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Originally posted by checkbaiterYou are so far removed from the teachings of Jesus its not funny. In Matt 25 Jesus divided all people into two groups, the righteous and the wicked.
The wicked are those who reject God's free gift of salvation.
The righteous were those who were charitable and showed love and consideration to their neighbour. These were called into Gods Kingdom. The cursed and wicked were those who did no such thing and who will be destroyed. Christ said these things many many times.
You cannot find any passage in the teachings of Christ and the Apostles that supports your completely fabricated church doctrine that .. The wicked are those who reject God's free gift of salvation
Originally posted by Rajk999Were you on vacation? I see you haven't changed from your "works " theology.
You are so far removed from the teachings of Jesus its not funny. In Matt 25 Jesus divided all people into two groups, the righteous and the wicked.
The righteous were those who were charitable and showed love and consideration to their neighbour. These were called into Gods Kingdom. The cursed and wicked were those who did no such thing and who wil ...[text shortened]... ated church doctrine that .. The wicked are those who reject God's free gift of salvation
Originally posted by checkbaiterYou believe in Christ with your mouth pal because you deny his teachings and substitute for it the teachings of man. Hypocrites will have no part in the Kingdom of God.
Were you on vacation? I see you haven't changed from your "works " theology.
Where in the Bible can you find support for your statement?
Originally posted by checkbaiterIf God exists (he doesn't, but if he did) it would indeed be our works and our works alone that determined our salvation or damnation (if such things existed, which they don't).
Were you on vacation? I see you haven't changed from your "works " theology.
Unless you are willing to compromise on the qualities you instill in God (all-loving, just etc) then the way we treat each other will be of the utmost importance to him. I'd go even further and say that as a 'good atheist' I will see heaven before a 'bad Christian' (someone who accepts the free gift of salvation but acts poorly).
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeMy idea of heaven would be looking down into hell and
If God exists (he doesn't, but if he did) it would indeed be our works and our works alone that determined our salvation or damnation (if such things existed, which they don't).
Unless you are willing to compromise on the qualities you instill in God (all-loving, just etc) then the way we treat each other will be of the utmost importance to him. I ...[text shortened]... eaven before a 'bad Christian' (someone who accepts the free gift of salvation but acts poorly).
seeing Grampy Bobby have to re-read all of his cut-n-pastes.
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeIf God exists (he doesn't, but if he did) it would indeed be our works and our works alone that determined our salvation or damnation (if such things existed, which they don't).
If God exists (he doesn't, but if he did) it would indeed be our works and our works alone that determined our salvation or damnation (if such things existed, which they don't).
Unless you are willing to compromise on the qualities you instill in God (all-loving, just etc) then the way we treat each other will be of the utmost importance to him. I ...[text shortened]... eaven before a 'bad Christian' (someone who accepts the free gift of salvation but acts poorly).
There are two ways to look at this.
1. The bible says that no one can be saved by works. We cannot earn our way to be approved by God. We have all sinned and fall short of God's standard. All the good works in the world will not out weigh the rottenness that is in us.
The bible says the heart is at fault, it is incurably sick. There is no remedy. Good works simply adorn the wicked heart we have.
But at it's core it is still evil. Just like you can clean and dress up a pig to look good, it will go back and wallow in the mud. That is it's nature. In the same way, man's nature is to sin. Greed, lust, immorality resides in the heart (our minds-or the seat of our deepest thoughts).
2. The other way to see this is God sent his Son to redeem us back from the god of this world(Satan). When we come to Jesus, we are transferred from one Kingdom(the world, the old nature, Satan's Kingdom) to a new Kingdom(that of Jesus where he is now our Lord instead of Satan).
At the new birth, we receive a "new heart" that wants to please God, thinks on things that are holy and pure. This "new " person wants to do good works and now has the power to do them. it is genuine and the good works are done because of this new nature that wants to do good. It is thankful, kind, etc.
One is called religion. This is what Rajk is into.
The latter is called God's Grace which supersedes all else.
We have to choose to be like the dressed up pig trying to look good or we can submit to Jesus and let Him transform us into what He wants.
I choose the latter.
The next question will be, "Are you saying all Christians are good and never sin?
No, I am not saying that. Even though we have this new nature, now it takes work to be transformed. Romans says this is done by "the renewing of our minds".
We are still subject to temptation, but so was Jesus. We now have a choice, follow after Jesus and do good or go back to what we were before. Stuck in a rut, subject to our evil desires.
Now in a way, it sounds like, what is the difference between what Rajk is saying?
Rajk has it backwards. He is doing the works to obtain salvation, when salvation is a free gift which cannot be earned. There is a big difference.
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Originally posted by checkbaiterIf Christ had truly transformed you and your ilk to be holy and pure and you have a new heart, then why is it that all you people DO is talk about how much you are such filthy sinners?
[b]If God exists (he doesn't, but if he did) it would indeed be our works and our works alone that determined our salvation or damnation (if such things existed, which they don't).
There are two ways to look at this.
1. The bible says that no one can be saved by works. We cannot earn our way to be approved by God. We have all sinned and fall short ...[text shortened]... tain salvation, when salvation is a free gift which cannot be earned. There is a big difference.[/b]
The truth is that God and Jesus Christ by his death has paved the way for all of mankind to be transformed. Christ has transformed many people, and these are not necessarily those in churches. They are all over the world and in all religions. They live righteously and they do good works that please God.
DOERS [OF GOOD WORKS] ARE JUST BEFORE GOD, NOT TALKERS.