1. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    13 Oct '08 02:11
    When did God create hell -- before or after the fall of man?

    Who was the first person to go to hell?
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    13 Oct '08 10:45
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    When did God create hell -- before or after the fall of man?

    Who was the first person to go to hell?
    abel
    which is pretty messed up.
  3. England
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    13 Oct '08 14:181 edit
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    When did God create hell -- before or after the fall of man?

    Who was the first person to go to hell?
    [a] about the same time, to my understanding, sent man out of eden with eve, and the devil to a kingdom with out god.
    [b] the devil and his followers, unless you mean in human terms,
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    13 Oct '08 15:07
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    Who was the first person to go to hell?
    By 'person' are you referring human beings? If not then Hell wouldn't be hell without the bad guy running it, now would it?
  5. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    13 Oct '08 17:344 edits
    Originally posted by Zahlanzi
    abel
    which is pretty messed up.
    Did man know murder was a sin before God issued the Sixth Commandment?

    If man already knew that murder was wrong, what was the point of issuing the Commandment?
    Also, wouldn't this also indicate that man actually does have the capacity to make correct moral judgments without being informed by God's word?

    On the other hand, if man didn't know that murder was wrong, was it just for God to send Cain to hell?
  6. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    13 Oct '08 17:37
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    If not then Hell wouldn't be hell without the bad guy running it, now would it?
    That is something that Christians tend to not have their story straight about. Some say that hell is nothing more than a place separate from God, in which case the devil's presence isn't essential.
  7. Standard memberRajk999
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    13 Oct '08 18:07
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    ...man actually does have the capacity to make correct moral judgments without being informed by God's word ...
    Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
    5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
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    13 Oct '08 18:13
    Originally posted by Zahlanzi
    abel
    which is pretty messed up.
    What do you mean ?
  9. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    13 Oct '08 18:141 edit
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
    5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
    If the fact that two people eating the fruit actually imparted knowledge of good and evil to all of their descendants ever after, what was the point of issuing the Commandments? Weren't they just superfluous at that point? Didn't everybody, in virtue of the ancestral fruit consumption, already know that it was wrong to covet and steal and murder and so on?
  10. Standard memberRajk999
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    13 Oct '08 18:30
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    If the fact that two people eating the fruit actually imparted knowledge of good and evil to all of their descendants ever after, what was the point of issuing the Commandments? Weren't they just superfluous at that point? Didn't everybody, in virtue of the ancestral fruit consumption, already know that it was wrong to covet and steal and murder and so on?
    Yes.
    Why do employers tell employees that its wrong to steal, arrive late, make personal phone calls on the company line when they already know all that. Why do governments do it?

    You still need to have the law written down because not everything is easily understood. Do you think that people will think of their own conscience that God wants them to observe the sabbath?
  11. Standard memberCrowley
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    13 Oct '08 18:52
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Yes.
    Why do employers tell employees that its wrong to steal, arrive late, make personal phone calls on the company line when they already know all that. Why do governments do it?

    You still need to have the law written down because not everything is easily understood. Do you think that people will think of their own conscience that God wants them to observe the sabbath?
    God could have saved himself much trouble by just going public...
  12. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    13 Oct '08 19:03
    Who was the first Christian to go to hell?
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    13 Oct '08 23:31
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    If the fact that two people eating the fruit actually imparted knowledge of good and evil to all of their descendants ever after, what was the point of issuing the Commandments? Weren't they just superfluous at that point? Didn't everybody, in virtue of the ancestral fruit consumption, already know that it was wrong to covet and steal and murder and so on?
    its allegory, not an actual event
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    13 Oct '08 23:371 edit
    Apologies, wrong post

    There is no concept of hell, purgatory, eternal torment and damnation for the wicked or ungodly anywhere in the original Hebrew scriptures nor in the Greek scriptures, the source of these present day church teachings seem to stem from a bastardisation of the original Hebrew/Greek words for the common grave of mankind, as a direct result of inaccurate translation from the original languages. the fact that many churches still cling to this superstition is evidence of their own inability to understand, accurately the scriptures which they purport to support! I defy anyone to prove otherwise!
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    13 Oct '08 23:47
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Apologies, wrong post

    There is no concept of hell, purgatory, eternal torment and damnation for the wicked or ungodly anywhere in the original Hebrew scriptures nor in the Greek scriptures, the source of these present day church teachings seem to stem from a bastardisation of the original Hebrew/Greek words for the common grave of mankind, as a di ...[text shortened]... tand, accurately the scriptures which they purport to support! I defy anyone to prove otherwise!
    What would you then say about this passage in the Hebrew Bible ?


    "And many of those who are sleeping in the dust of the ground will awake, some to life eternal and some to reproach, to eternal contempt." (Daniel 12:2)
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