01 May '07 04:51>
Originally posted by whodeyFirst of all, by any Jewish standard, Jesus did not fulfill the role of Messiah -- one who raises
I think the most striking arguements revolve around the prophesies mentioned. I have mentioned Daniel 9:24-27 on more than one occasion in which the prediction of the coming of the Messiah is fortold. When one reads the prophesy, however, it seems abstract and hard to understand because we simply do not talk about such things in this way today. However, it has been interpreted to mean that the Messiah was fortold to come during the life of Christ.
up the Jewish people and liberates Israel from oppression. It is only an utter reinterpretation of the
term that anyone could possibly use the claim that Daniel 'foretold' of Jesus. This is why the Jewish
scholars balk at the use of the term in correspondence to Jesus -- He didn't do what a 'Messiah'
ought to do (as far as the OT authors defined it). Sure, you can say 'Well, he freed us from spiritual
bondage,' or whatever but, again, it requires a very liberal understanding of the 'prophecy' which
undermines any evidentiary weight it might offer a person.
Second of all, many of the 'prophecies' in the Bible that 'came true' were written after the fact.
This is not peculiar to Christian Scripture; Isaiah (composed by no fewer than three and possibly
as many as six authors) is riddled with 'predictions' written well after the fact. And so, I find it
pretty unimpressive to for an author in the post-Temple period to write, 'Jesus said that the Temple
would fall,' because the author already knew the event happened and had a distinct interest in
making Jesus look good. More telling are the prophecies that didn't come true, such as Jesus'
claim in St Luke 21:25-33 --
There will be signs in the sun, the moon, and the stars, and on earth nations will be in dismay,
perplexed by the roaring of the sea and the waves. People will die of fright in anticipation of what
is coming upon the world, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then they will see the
Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. But when these signs begin to happen,
stand erect and raise your heads because your redemption is at hand....Consider the fig tree and all
the other trees. When their buds burst open, you see for yourselves and know that summer is now
near; in the same way, when you see these things happening, know that the kingdom of God is near.
Amen, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have taken place.
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my works will not pass away.
Now, you can argue that Jesus was speaking metaphorically, but remember He was speaking to an
audience. He was telling them 'Be ready!' If He wasn't wrong, then He was at the very least deceptive
in using the familiar second person plural rather than referring to a distant future, in saying 'this
generation'
when He really meant 'Humankind' altogether. C.S. Lewis, a devout Christian, himself said that this
was the most embarrassing verse in Scripture (21:32, that is).
Thirdly, the so-called predictions that were used midrashically to validate Jesus' actions are hardly
probative. 'Not a bone will be broken' or 'for his vesture they cast lots' or that Jesus asked for wine
to fulfill Scripture. The OT is a long text, and the Psalms are pretty esoteric; it's not hard to look
at any hero's life and see a verse here and there that qualify, or, like above, to have Jesus conveniently
do something that ties into an obscure verse. This was a known, well-recognized, and well-documented
technique used by Jewish writers.
So, I hardly find any of these arguments striking, especially since charlatan Christians (most notably
Adventists) have been trying to scare people into believing Jesus is on his way imminently for the
past 100+ years.
Nemesio