244d
@kellyjay saidIf there were no sentient beings in the universe, there would be no value judgements, neither good nor evil. In this sense, they are not objective facts about the universe, like the existence of matter and energy. However, this does not mean that good and evil are whatever one individual thinks they are.
Good and Evil, are they a real part of the universe or something made up that are both very malleable to suit the one using those terms?
@kellyjay saidI think if the bible is clear on something there should be no reason to discuss this. God created everything including evil.
Good and Evil, are they a real part of the universe or something made up that are both very malleable to suit the one using those terms?
I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things. Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it. (Isaiah 45:5-8 KJV)
This was stated several times in different ways. People who want to change what is says have promoted a doctrine that God is only about peace and love.
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@moonbus saidIf they are not objective facts exactly how do you justify they are not whatever anyone thinks or wants, what else is there?
If there were no sentient beings in the universe, there would be no value judgements, neither good nor evil. In this sense, they are not objective facts about the universe, like the existence of matter and energy. However, this does not mean that good and evil are whatever one individual thinks they are.
244d
@rajk999 saidI can agree with what you said, except it should be discussed.
I think if the bible is clear on something there should be no reason to discuss this. God created everything including evil.
[i]I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. ...[text shortened]... ople who want to change what is says have promoted a doctrine that God is only about peace and love.
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244d
@rajk999 saidYou label others as morons? You are audacious in criticizing what God has created. And you are an hypocrite for not seeing it.
I think if the bible is clear on something there should be no reason to discuss this. God created everything including evil.
[i]I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. ...[text shortened]... ople who want to change what is says have promoted a doctrine that God is only about peace and love.
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244d
@moonbus saidKelly has only one thing in mind, the Bible's take on good and evil.
If there were no sentient beings in the universe, there would be no value judgements, neither good nor evil. In this sense, they are not objective facts about the universe, like the existence of matter and energy. However, this does not mean that good and evil are whatever one individual thinks they are.
Even without any highly sentient beings, those lesser sentient animals such as ourselves, can note that the Sun is both good and evil for us. Too close, and we are evilly toasted, but at the proper distance, and with a few atmospheric conditions in place, it's good for life. Whether the distance is merely accidental or intentional, it's good for some of us to know, but evil for others to know. Those others think they know that a simple act of innocent disobedience is evil enough to get us kicked out of a garden of Eden, where we had it made for good. For good, also to imply forever and ever.
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@pettytalk saidWhat is my take on good and evil? Can we know evil without good?
Kelly has only one thing in mind, the Bible's take on good and evil.
Even without any highly sentient beings, those lesser sentient animals such as ourselves, can note that the Sun is both good and evil for us. Too close, and we are evilly toasted, but at the proper distance, and with a few atmospheric conditions in place, it's good for life. Whether the distance is mere ...[text shortened]... ed out of a garden of Eden, where we had it made for good. For good, also to imply forever and ever.
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244d
@kellyjay saidI have told you that before, and not just once. I have also given you my take on the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. It's a world of opposites in which we live. We need contrast, and without it, there is nothing to see. It will be all black, or all white, and nothing will stand out except one color.
What is my take on good and evil? Can we know evil without good?
’If the world, Socrates, were as ready to receive your words as I am,
there would be greater peace and less evil among mankind.’
Evil, Theodorus, must ever remain in this world to be the antagonist of good,
out of the way of the gods in heaven. Wherefore also we should fly away from
ourselves to them; and to fly to them is to become like them; and to become
like them is to become holy, just and true. But many live in the old wives’ fable
of appearances; they think that you should follow virtue in order that you may
seem to be good. And yet the truth is, that God is righteous; and of men, he is
most like him who is most righteous. To know this is wisdom; and in comparison
of this the wisdom of the arts (including science) or the seeming wisdom of politicians is mean and common. --- Plato's THEAETETUS
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@pettytalk saidIs that what I asked you?
I have told you that before, and not just once. I have also given you my take on the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. It's a world of opposites in which we live. We need contrast, and without it, there is nothing to see. It will be all black, or all white, and nothing will stand out except one color.
’If the world, Socrates, were as ready to receive your words as ...[text shortened]... including science) or the seeming wisdom of politicians is mean and common. --- Plato's THEAETETUS
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@kellyjay saidWhat else is there ? What sentient brings say there is, only it is not dependent one person’s whim. It takes two to tango, and a village to raise a child. Good and evil are defined by societies and cultures over long periods of time. And while they often agree on a few broad points, such prohibitions against homicide and theft, there are some notable exceptions (such as honor killing in some Middle Eastern societies).
If they are not objective facts exactly how do you justify they are not whatever anyone thinks or wants, what else is there?
244d
@pettytalk saidThere is nothing either good or evil about the distance from the Earth to the sun. That the weather or ambient temperature is “good for” something, such as growing plants or animals , including ourselves, has no moral quality.
Kelly has only one thing in mind, the Bible's take on good and evil.
Even without any highly sentient beings, those lesser sentient animals such as ourselves, can note that the Sun is both good and evil for us. Too close, and we are evilly toasted, but at the proper distance, and with a few atmospheric conditions in place, it's good for life. Whether the distance is mere ...[text shortened]... ed out of a garden of Eden, where we had it made for good. For good, also to imply forever and ever.
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@moonbus saidYou are talking more about cultural norms than good and evil, ethics and morals. I'd even add they are attributes to beings as well.
What else is there ? What sentient brings say there is, only it is not dependent one person’s whim. It takes two to tango, and a village to raise a child. Good and evil are defined by societies and cultures over long periods of time. And while they often agree on a few broad points, such prohibitions against homicide and theft, there are some notable exceptions (such as honor killing in some Middle Eastern societies).