Is the Bible really Holy

Originally posted by chaney3
I strongly disagree. Jesus preached many good things, but it's not so simple. Who really knows who Jesus is? Catholics have the 'true' answer, yet the Jehovah Witness has the 'true' answer, yet the Orthodox Christian has the 'true' answer. Yet, the Baptist Christian has the 'true' answer. If I am making a statement, it is that nobody truly knows what is going on in the Spiritual Realm.

I disagree here as well. They can't all be right. Only one is right.

Originally posted by RBHILL
I disagree here as well. They can't all be right. Only one is right.

You say that only one is right. Who is it? Who is right? Again, the Bible is littered with evil and controversy. Who is right Hill?

Originally posted by chaney3
Considering that we know that the Bible was 'put together' by so called leaders from various writings that they deemed worthy enough to be in the Bible......can our current Bible be trusted to be 'Holy'? It seems logical that 100's or 1000's of 'books' did not make it into the Bible based on the decisions of humans. Are we truly getting the whole picture o ...[text shortened]... imple for everyone to comprehend.

Maybe the Bible itself has caused atheism?

Any thoughts?

You have a distorted view of evil and the Holy Bible.

God destroyed Sodom in judgment of evil.

God caused the flood of Noah in judgment of evil.

Lot offered his daughters in desperation in an attempt to save his guests from what he believed was a greater evil. (No rape took place because the guests struck the evil ones with blindness.)

God hardened the heart of Pharaoh to magnify Pharaoh's evil and to show God's power and right to judge the rulers of Egypt for their evil.

The Jewish religion celebrates Passover as a 'holiday' to celebrate the day they were saved from the evil of slavery by the Eqyptians.

HalleluYaH !!! Praise the LORD! Holy! Holy! Holy! 😏

Holliness

The state or character of being holy. Holiness means “religious cleanness or purity; sacredness.” Also, the original Hebrew qoʹdhesh conveys the thought of separateness, exclusiveness, or sanctification to God, who is holy; a state of being set aside to the service of God. In the Christian Greek Scriptures, the words rendered “holy” (haʹgi·os) and “holiness” (ha·gi·a·smosʹ [also, “sanctification”]; ha·gi·oʹtes; ha·gi·o·syʹne) likewise denote separation to God; they also are used to refer to holiness as a quality of God and to purity or perfection in one’s personal conduct.

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200002055#h=1:0-27:1370

Originally posted by chaney3
The title of this thread is whether one believes the Holy Bible is in fact 'Holy'. It seems to me that scripture has always been disputed, and continues to this day. There seems nothing Holy about it.

You dispute "Holy" but use the term "Creator" without justifying it. It seems like a case of the pot calling the kettle black. Just another squabble between theists.

Originally posted by chaney3

[b]When we think of ancient Egyptians worshiping the god Rah....we laugh.
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We do? It has never caused me to laugh.

Mankind has always wondered who created all of this. Our current opinion is that all is explained in our 'Holy Bible', and it is my belief that we may be all wrong.
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I would not say "ALL" is explained in the Bible. Genesis is actually very brief in its telling us of God the Creator. It is not an exhaustive explanation of "all" by any means.

Had it been that we might have 66 books just dedicated to how God made a piece of dirt or a drop of water.

There are really two accounts of creation in Genesis - chapters 1 and 2. In both among all other living things human beings are at the apex. In chapter one he is the last life created and given dominion over all other living creatures. In chapter two he seems to be created last but gives names and defines all other living creatures.

In both accounts the top and pinnacle of the pyramid of living things is occupied by man. And man is placed before something called "the tree of life" . The man created in the image of God and according to the likeness of God is a vessel made for the Uncreated Divine Person to dispense Himself into.

That we were given 'texts' by ancestors to make an effort to explain.
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There are some things about Genesis that convince me that this is a divine writing. Some things in it persuade me that God is speaking to us and not any human being no matter how wise.

It is certainly plausible that human beings put together a 'book' based on ancient writings, and these 'experts' called this book Holy. I am not convinced.
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Well, tell me how the prophet Micah could know beforehand by some 500 years, that a person would be born in Bethlehem who not only claimed to be from eternity but ACTED like it too?

" But you, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, so little to be among the thousands of Judah, From you there will come forth to Me He who is to be Ruler in Israel;

And His goings forth are from ancient times, From the days of eternity." (Micah 5:1,2)

The priests and scribes were quite familiar with the prophesy and told Herod that he should look to the city of Bethlehem for any one born messianic King of the Jews.

"And His goings forth are from ancient times, from the days of eternity." This one to look for in Bethlehem was not just a born king. But He is one from eternity. Only God Himself is from eternity. The point is the Jesus Christ, born in Bethlehem spoke and acted as God from eternity come to us as a born man.

The writing of the Bible is not just explaining what the thunder in the sky is.

It should be conceivable to anyone reading this that a 'real God' is not something that we humans could even comprehend, let alone define.
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That is unless God is reaching out to us, revealing Himself to us, extending the revelation of Himself to us.

Don't you think we could have relationship with the real God, enjoy the real God, experience the real God without exhaustively comprehending Him ?

If you check even your natural experience there are a few things which we do not fully comprehend yet we experience, enjoy, and benefit from them.

Originally posted by RJHinds
You have a distorted view of evil and the Holy Bible.

God destroyed Sodom in judgment of evil.

God caused the flood of Noah in judgment of evil.

Lot offered his daughters in desperation in an attempt to save his guests from what he believed was a greater evil. (No rape took place because the guests struck the evil ones with blindness.)

God hard ...[text shortened]... m the evil of slavery by the Eqyptians.

HalleluYaH !!! Praise the LORD! Holy! Holy! Holy! 😏

So... what was the dealio creating people with free will and then destroying them all after they chose to do stuff that he didn't like? Seems like a pretty dodgy sort of god to me. Not even control freakery that, just a total dick-move.

Originally posted by avalanchethecat
So... what was the dealio creating people with free will and then destroying them all after they chose to do stuff that he didn't like? Seems like a pretty dodgy sort of god to me. Not even control freakery that, just a total dick-move.

Do you understand what a reprobate is? Someone who is beyond redemption. Now the charge that they were destroyed because they exercised free will and did 'stuff', that God allegedly did not like was not why they were judicially executed ,was it? No! it was because they would not repent which is not Gods fault for endowing anyone with free will or with inculcating a sense of morality in people, its the fault of people for ignoring warnings. Its not God that is dodgy, just your logic.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Do you understand what a reprobate is? Someone who is beyond redemption. Now the charge that they were destroyed because they exercised free will and did 'stuff', that God allegedly did not like was not why they were judicially executed ,was it? No! it was because they would not repent which is not Gods fault for endowing anyone with free will or wit ...[text shortened]... ople, its the fault of people for ignoring warnings. Its not God that is dodgy, just your logic.

So "they would not repent" was something God did not like.

How anybody would refuse to repent like crazy when presented with a credible ultimatum of eternal fire, is a little hard to believe. Of course, repenting in such circumstances may be seen by God as a fake ploy to save one's skin. It would be far better if fear were not triggered, so repentance was sought out of love, not fear. But this seems not to be how the story goes.

Originally posted by chaney3
I really want to hear from everyone on this forum regarding this topic. Everything we have been taught has come from the Bible. Can we truly trust the Bible on all issues?

To make my point.....Dive....I hope you don't mind me bringing this up.....but, as a Christian......you claimed that you were ready to discard the New Testament. That is a huge leap. Can we really trust the Holy Bible....that is my point.

OK. I'm not interested in your shallow arguments chaney3. There reason we clashed the instant you landed in this forum is that I see through your approach of "I want everyone to talk to me about my genuine questions right now" as you looking to pressure test and reinforce your weak self assurance in rejecting Christ. And you have rejected Christ haven't you? After some thought I decided to give you the benefit of the doubt and spent several lengthy posts trying to help you by answering what you claimed were your genuine seeking questions. Robbie carrobie tried to befriend you and your reward him with the question "do you think Jesus ever got a hard on?"

In short I find you to be insincere, lacking in any real depth of thought and therefore bringing very little to this forum. I'm not interested in your juvenile yapping about "God doesn't exit 'cos evil happens".

For the record I did not say I was ready to discard the NT; what I said was that if it was proven to me the the writers of the eternal hell claims in Revelation categorically meant it as literal then I would discard all thier writings. It's a statement of my confidence that it is not literal, and I stand by it.

Originally posted by RBHILL
I disagree here as well. They can't all be right. Only one is right.

What if they're all partially right?

Originally posted by RBHILL
I disagree here as well. They can't all be right. Only one is right.

What if they are all wrong?

Originally posted by JS357
So "they would not repent" was something God did not like.

How anybody would refuse to repent like crazy when presented with a credible ultimatum of eternal fire, is a little hard to believe. Of course, repenting in such circumstances may be seen by God as a fake ploy to save one's skin. It would be far better if fear were not triggered, so repentance was sought out of love, not fear. But this seems not to be how the story goes.

Lack of repentance was only a symptom of a prevailing attitude, an attitude that was irredeemable. I cannot find a single reference where an ultimatum of eternal fire was issued.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Do you understand what a reprobate is? Someone who is beyond redemption. Now the charge that they were destroyed because they exercised free will and did 'stuff', that God allegedly did not like was not why they were judicially executed ,was it? No! it was because they would not repent which is not Gods fault for endowing anyone with free will or wit ...[text shortened]... ople, its the fault of people for ignoring warnings. Its not God that is dodgy, just your logic.

"Someone who is beyond redemption."
that's not what jesus said. in fact, he said the opposite. everyone can be saved.

" it was because they would not repent "
what was the time limit to repent?
the infants had like 4-5 months to repent since they were born and until the flood/soddom/jericho happened. seems to me to short a time to consider repenting for the evil you did during your 4-5 months (craping their diapers)

jesus says serial killers may repent even on their death beds.
are you saying serial killers get more time to repent than the children had just before the flood?

are you saying that the ark was supposed to house how many animals, but they couldn't make room for 10 extra children? or even 8?

"Its not God that is dodgy, just your logic."
heh hilarious. noah saves pigeons but not one child. you don't see any issue with that but you consider someone who points out these flaws as illogical.

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
"Someone who is beyond redemption."
that's not what jesus said. in fact, he said the opposite. everyone can be saved.

" it was because they would not repent "
what was the time limit to repent?
the infants had like 4-5 months to repent since they were born and until the flood/soddom/jericho happened. seems to me to short a time to consider repenting ...[text shortened]... don't see any issue with that but you consider someone who points out these flaws as illogical.

No he didn't you namby pamby soft sided underbelly of a gay dolphin called Lenny, he stated that there would be a great tribulation, that only those that exercise faith can be saved, etc etc

"For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven" ( Matthew 5:20)

"I tell you, on the day of judgment you will have to give an account for every careless word you utter; for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned." ( Matthew 12:36-37)

"The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will collect out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all evildoers, and they will throw them into the furnace of fire, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father." ( Matthew 13:41-43)

"For this reason the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his slaves ... So my heavenly Father will also do to every one of you, if you do not forgive your brother or sister from your heart." ( Matthew 18:23-35)

"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on the throne of his glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats . . . And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life." ( Matthew 25:31-46)

"Not everyone who says to me 'Lord, Lord' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven." ( Matthew 7:21)

"Everyone therefore who acknowledges me before others, I also will acknowledge before my Father in heaven; but whoever denies me before others, I also will deny before my Father in heaven." ( Matthew 10:32-33)

"Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever becomes humble like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven." ( Matthew 18:3-4)

Now the claim was not made that no one can or cannot repent, the actual claim (your silly strawman notwithstanding) was that persons were judicially executed (as in the flood) because they were irredeemable. Any logical, rational and reasoning person can discern the difference. Nothing Jesus ever said negates this.