Spirituality
15 Apr 18
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @rajk999It fits in, but they way you think it does.
Did not Jesus say that God His Father was greater than Him?
Where does that fit in.
Did not Paul also say that the head of Christ is God?
There's not enough time and space in this forum to school you in how to employ proper and correct exegesis of the scriptures, but it would be helpful to you if you would take 30 seconds and read Isaiah 44:6 and Revelation 22:13.
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonMore BS
It fits in, but they way you think it does.
There's not enough time and space in this forum to school you in how to employ proper and correct exegesis of the scriptures, but it would be helpful to you if you would take 30 seconds and read Isaiah 44:6 and Revelation 22:13.
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @rajk999Did not Jesus say...
Did not Jesus say that God His Father was greater than Him?
Where does that fit in.
Did not Paul also say that the head of Christ is God?
John 8:56-59 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” 57 So the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?” 58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.” 59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but Jesus child Himself and went out of the temple.
Rajk999, who/what is I AM?
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonThe interesting thing is Revelation 22:13 is Jesus own words.
It fits in, but they way you think it does.
There's not enough time and space in this forum to school you in how to employ proper and correct exegesis of the scriptures, but it would be helpful to you if you would take 30 seconds and read Isaiah 44:6 and Revelation 22:13.
Originally posted by @leunammiYou really need to educate yourself:
Did not Jesus say...
[b]John 8:56-59 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” 57 So the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?” 58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.” 59 Therefore they p ...[text shortened]... row at Him, but Jesus child Himself and went out of the temple.
Rajk999, who/what is I AM?[/b]
What is the claim where Jesus says, “before Abraham came into being, I am” (John 8:58)?
Is the author of the Gospel of John claiming that Jesus is part of a tri-unity god when he has Jesus say, “before Abraham came into being, I am” (John 8:58)?
Answer: John 8:56-58 states: “‘Abraham your father rejoiced to see my day; and he saw it, and was glad.’ The Jews therefore said to him: ‘You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?’ Jesus said to them: ‘Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham came into being, I am.'”
Trinitarians argue that the Greek words ego eimi (“I am“ ), allegedly spoken by Jesus (John 8:58), indicate that Jesus is God (see also John 8:24, 28). They arrive at their contention by connecting the phrase “I am” with the words spoken by God in Exodus 3:14 and often translated: “I AM THAT I AM . . . . Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: I AM has sent me to you.” However, the literal and proper translation of this verse is: I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE. . . . Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: I WILL BE has sent me to you.” Since the author of the Gospel of John utilized the Greek Septuagint translation of the Bible in his writings, it cannot be assumed that John’s Jesus is referring to the words in Exodus 3:14. Although Jesus actually spoke in Hebrew or Aramaic, not Greek, John recorded Jesus’ alleged words in Greek. Ego eimi (“I am“ ), used by John’s Jesus, is not the same as ho on (“The Being, The One Who Is“ ), which is used in the Septuagint’s rendering of Exodus 3:14: “And God spoke to Moses, saying, I am THE BEING; and He said, Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: THE BEING has sent me to you.” Even though ho on appears in the Gospel of John, it is never used as a title or name or exclusively as a reference to Jesus. In the Book of Revelation, also credited to John by Christian commentators, ho on appears five times (Revelation 1:4, 8; 4:8; 11:17; 16:5). Significantly, in each instance, it is used as a title or designation applied to God, not Jesus.
Pasted from <https://jewsforjudaism.org/knowledge/articles/what-is-the-claim-where-jesus-says-qbefore-abraham-came-into-being-i-amq-john-858/>
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonLike I said:
It's there. You just can't see it.
Consider Isaiah 44:6 and Revelation 22:13.
Rajk can't do it, but maybe you have more brass than him. We'll see.
<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God.>>
Neither verse has anything to do with the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonWhat part of the following didn't you understand?
Apparently neither Rajk nor ThinkOfOne has the brass to address Isaiah 44:6 and Revelation 22:13.
Too busy I guess. Doing what? Certainly not in pursuit of the truth obviously.
Like I said:
<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God.>>
Neither verse has anything to do with the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonNobody needs to address Isaiah.
Apparently neither Rajk nor ThinkOfOne has the brass to address Isaiah 44:6 and Revelation 22:13.
Too busy I guess. Doing what? Certainly not in pursuit of the truth obviously.
Once Jesus is here we do not need the prophets.
Jesus is God .. you forgot?
God said: Jesus [God], is His Son [Also God]
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @thinkofoneWould I be correct in saying you deny the divinity of Jesus?
You really need to educate yourself:What is the claim where Jesus says, “before Abraham came into being, I am” (John 8:58)?
Is the author of the Gospel of John claiming that Jesus is part of a tri-unity god when he has Jesus say, “before Abraham came into being, I am” (John 8:58)?
Answer: John 8:56-58 states: “‘Abraham your father rejoic ...[text shortened]... s/what-is-the-claim-where-jesus-says-qbefore-abraham-came-into-being-i-amq-john-858/>
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @leunammiYes you'd be correct. In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to literally be God. He just didn't. No amount of distorting His words into something He didn't say is going to change that fact.
Would I be correct in saying you deny the divinity of Jesus?
16 Apr 18
Originally posted by @thinkofoneI understand perfectly.
What part of the following didn't you understand?Like I said:
<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God.>>
Neither verse has anything to do with the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.
You are evading the part I posted, which, if you had the intellectual integrity to address, would prove your understanding of the scriptures concerning the true identity of Jesus Christ is fallacious.
On this single point does your whole argument fail.
That's why both you and Rajk are loathe to answer.
Originally posted by @secondsonIf you had any "intellectual integrity" you'd realize that you responded to my post which asserted:
I understand perfectly.
You are evading the part I posted, which, if you had the intellectual integrity to address, would prove your understanding of the scriptures concerning the true identity of Jesus Christ is fallacious.
On this single point does your whole argument fail.
That's why both you and Rajk are loathe to answer.
<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God.>>
Citing Isaiah and Revelation does not address my assertion since neither are part of the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.
No matter how many times I've pointed this out to you, you've ignored it in your zeal to make disparaging remarks.
You're as dishonest as they come.
You claim to "understand perfectly" when the reality is that you fail to even understand a basic premise of my assertion.
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Originally posted by @thinkofoneAre you planning to answer why you think Jesus’ disciples and Gospel writers fabricated parts of the Gospels, including quotes from Jesus?
If you had any "intellectual integrity" you'd realize that you responded to my post which asserted:
<<In the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry, He never claimed to be God.>>
Citing Isaiah and Revelation does not address my assertion since neither are part of the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry.
No matter how many times I'v ...[text shortened]... perfectly" when the reality is that you fail to even understand a basic premise of my assertion.
Do you have any evidence that parts of the Gospels were fabricated?
17 Apr 18
Originally posted by @romans1009Are you planning to ask any well-considered meaningful questions?
Are you planning to answer why you think Jesus’ disciples and Gospel writers fabricated parts of the Gospels, including quotes from Jesus?
Do you have any evidence that parts of the Gospels were fabricated?