1. Standard memberchaney3
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    15 Oct '18 11:14
    "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do".

    Is it possible that God doesn't really know how we think, or how we'll act, which is why Jesus made this statement?
  2. Standard memberKellyJay
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    15 Oct '18 11:27
    @chaney3 said
    "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do".

    Is it possible that God doesn't really know how we think, or how we'll act, which is why Jesus made this statement?
    He knows, we are the ones that don’t see the damage we do.
  3. Standard memberchaney3
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    15 Oct '18 11:30
    @kellyjay said
    He knows, we are the ones that don’t see the damage we do.
    Then Jesus should not have needed to tell Him.
  4. Standard memberSecondSon
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    15 Oct '18 11:43
    @chaney3 said
    "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do".

    Is it possible that God doesn't really know how we think, or how we'll act, which is why Jesus made this statement?
    God knows "how" we think, and what and why.

    That's why Jesus said forgive them.

    That's God's grace. God sent His Son, an innocent substitute, to die in our place and pay our sin debt so that we can have eternal life.
  5. Standard memberSecondSon
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    15 Oct '18 11:45
    @chaney3 said
    Then Jesus should not have needed to tell Him.
    And you should decide what God needs to say?
  6. Standard memberchaney3
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    15 Oct '18 12:08
    @secondson said
    And you should decide what God needs to say?
    No, but if God already knew that we know not what we do, then Jesus didn't need to tell Him.

    That's why I brought up the question.
  7. Standard memberSecondSon
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    15 Oct '18 13:44
    @chaney3 said
    No, but if God already knew that we know not what we do, then Jesus didn't need to tell Him.

    That's why I brought up the question.
    But it seems you're assuming that Jesus said to the Father "they know not what they do" because God didn't know.

    That's not why. You should be grateful Jesus did say that. You see, that's why Jesus went to the cross, so that God would be justified in forgiving sinners.

    Jesus did the will of His Father. We don't. That's the truth.

    All God is asking for is your whole heart. He does the rest.
  8. Standard memberKellyJay
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    15 Oct '18 14:00
    @chaney3 said
    Then Jesus should not have needed to tell Him.
    Why, more than once Jesus said things to the Father for the benfit of those around Him.
  9. Standard memberchaney3
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    15 Oct '18 20:50
    @kellyjay said
    Why, more than once Jesus said things to the Father for the benfit of those around Him.
    All I'm saying is that if God knew that humans know not what we do, then why would Jesus need to tell Him.

    It just dawned on me that if Jesus 'was' God, as believed by Trinitarians, then He likely would not have said it, but if Jesus is NOT God, then it makes more sense.
  10. Standard memberKellyJay
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    15 Oct '18 22:361 edit
    @chaney3 said
    All I'm saying is that if God knew that humans know not what we do, then why would Jesus need to tell Him.

    It just dawned on me that if Jesus 'was' God, as believed by Trinitarians, then He likely would not have said it, but if Jesus is NOT God, then it makes more sense.
    John 11:41-43 English Standard Version (ESV)
    41 So they took away the stone. And Jesus lifted up his eyes and said, “Father, I thank you that you have heard me. 42 I knew that you always hear me, but I said this on account of the people standing around, that they may believe that you sent me.” 43 When he had said these things, he cried out with a loud voice, “Lazarus, come out.”


    John 12:29-31 English Standard Version (ESV)
    29 The crowd that stood there and heard it said that it had thundered. Others said, “An angel has spoken to him.” 30 Jesus answered, “This voice has come for your sake, not mine. 31 Now is the judgment of this world; now will the ruler of this world be cast out.
  11. Standard memberRemoved
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    15 Oct '18 23:05
    @chaney3 said
    No, but if God already knew that we know not what we do, then Jesus didn't need to tell Him.

    That's why I brought up the question.
    This proposition vaguely reminds me of Little Dog claiming God was not omniscient based on God asking questions in Genesis.

    That colossal blunder on Poodle Boy’s part and subsequent disgrace and shame led the Native Americans on RHP to nickname him “Flaming Cheeks of Embarrassment,” and he’s never been the same since.
  12. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    16 Oct '18 10:28
    @chaney3 said
    "Father forgive them, for they know not what they do".

    Is it possible that God doesn't really know how we think, or how we'll act, which is why Jesus made this statement?
    As the Lord said in Isaiah, "Put Me in remembrance" (43:26).

    It is as if God can forget, and we have to remind Him. God may have promised, but He needs us to remind Him. We should say, not with a heart of unbelief but with a heart of faith, "Lord, You have given me Your promise. You should remember Your promise." This is exactly what King Solomon did. He said to God, "Now, O Lord God, let thy promise unto David my father be established" (2 Chron. 1:9). This way of reminding God is very meaningful. The reason that God delays His promise is that we may have the opportunity to deal with Him. In this way we acquire new knowledge; we have learned how to remind Him.

    (Watchman Nee - Vol. 10: The Present Testimony)
  13. Standard memberchaney3
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    16 Oct '18 11:07
    @ghost-of-a-duke said
    As the Lord said in Isaiah, "Put Me in remembrance" (43:26).

    It is as if God can forget, and we have to remind Him. God may have promised, but He needs us to remind Him. We should say, not with a heart of unbelief but with a heart of faith, "Lord, You have given me Your promise. You should remember Your promise." This is exactly what King Solomon did. He said to Go ...[text shortened]... new knowledge; we have learned how to remind Him.

    (Watchman Nee - Vol. 10: The Present Testimony)
    God needs to be reminded.
    Interesting.
  14. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    16 Oct '18 11:09
    @chaney3 said
    God needs to be reminded.
    Interesting.
    He is old.
    My dad needed reminding to put his pants on as he got older.

    And we are made in god's image.
  15. SubscriberFMF
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    16 Oct '18 11:15
    @wolfgang59 said
    He is old.
    My dad needed reminding to put his pants on as he got older.

    And we are made in god's image.
    Oh? So what did your dad's bare legs look like?
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