Originally posted by josephw
[b]"Please point out what I wrote which is "extra-biblical." "
Am I clear?
No, you are not clear to me yet. I am not sure if you are criticizing the writing on the Incarnation
of Christ or the full salvation of the believers in Christ, or both.
So I will briefly respond to both possibilities.
First concerning the Incarnation of Christ as a man.
I will only reply to this statement and disregard the rest so as to make my point pointedly clear. The following statement for example:
Through Christ’s work in His incarnation not only was God brought into man, but God was also made one with man. Christ has accomplished the great work of making God one with man,..
It's twisted. "God...made one with man" is not a scriptural concept, it falls short of what is taught by God's Word concerning our union with God in Christ.
God made one with man is
a scriptural concept in incarnation, or you don't really believe in incarnation.
When the Bible says in Isaiah 9:6
that the "child born"
has the name "Mighty God"
is that not God made one with man ?
Are you saying that for the Word to become flesh in John 1:14
was not for God to be made one with man ? How then did the Word become flesh but not become man ?
I affirm the following -
•Christ, the only begotten Son of God (John 1:18; 3:16), even God Himself (John 1:1), became a genuine man through incarnation (John 1:14), having both the divine and human natures (Rom. 9:5; 1 Tim. 2:5), the two natures being combined in one person and being preserved distinctly without confusion or change and without forming a third nature;
Concerning Christ dispensing God into man, is that not God becoming one with man ?
If the church is "the Body of Christ"
and Christ is "God manifest in the flesh"
then the church is God made one with man.
The end of the process of being conformed to His image reproduces many sons of God as brothers of the Firstborn Son -
"Because those whom He foreknew, He also predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the Firstborn among many brothers ..." (Romans 8:29)
1.) Christ is God become a man and the saved are being conformed to the image of the Son, then why is not the end result of the process of conformation that God is one with man ?
2.) If Paul meant that only by Christ incarnation that we are conformed to the image of His Son, then why is there a need to be "conformed"
I think it is quite obviously scriptural that in being joined to the Lord (1 Cor. 6:17)
our human spirit is made "one spirit"
with the Lord. And at the end of the process of transformation and conformation we arrive to be "like Him" [b](1 John 3:2)
Either Christ is not God made one with man and us being like Him is therefore our not being made one with God.
Or is God made one with man but we will not be like Him.
I don't know which unbiblical teaching you support. But I believe both - Christ is God made one with man on one hand, and the end result of His full salvation is that we the saved are made "like Him"
. So the church becomes a collective manifestation of God made one with man.
While I am in the process of sanctification. God certainly has been made one with one part of my being already - my regenerated human spirit for - "He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit" (1 Cor. 3:6)
Are you teaching that the Lord Jesus is not God ?
Or are you teaching that He is not joined to me to be one spirit with me ?
Or you teaching that to be "one spirit"
with the Lord Spirit is not for God to be made one with man ?
There is one more thing. In the statement I quoted above it is said that "through Christ's work in His incarnation..." ; an idea I find most troubling, since it was His work on the cross that accomplished anything in relation to our union with God.
I find your stumbling at this rather ridiculous. Christ's WORK includes His being incarnation, and thirty three and one half years of living, and His death on the cross, and His resurrection too.
While He was living He was preparing for us a perfect humanity for our living as well. That is why as the last Adam who became a life giving Spirit (1 Cor. 15:45)
all that He is is prepared to be imparted into us that we may be perfected in Him.
Do you not think that "the bountiful supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ" (Phil. 1:19)
includes all the riches of His human living ? I definitely include in this "bountiful supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ"
includes all of what He accomplished in incarnation, human living, death and resurrection.
I do not mean we Christians can accomplish eternal redemption or that we can shed our blood for anyone's sins.
But Paul definitely identified the one body of Christ as "the Christ"
"For even as the body is one and has many members, yet all the members of the body, being many, are one body, so also is the Christ." (1 Cor. 12:12)
Notice carefully that Paul said "so also is THE CHRIST"
. We might have expected Paul to say "so also is the church" or "so also is the body of Christ". But here he says "so also is the Christ"
making an utter identification of the church, the body of Christ with Christ Himself.
Rather than dumb down the teaching to excuse for poor experience we should rather stand by faith all the more on the truth. We should embrace the truth in faith rather than reject it as "troubling."
Christ is certainly God made one with man and the body of Christ, the church is " the Christ " (1 Cor. 12:12) [b]. So how cannot the church be a corporate expression of God made one with man ?
One more thing. If you object to Christ's incarnation as being Christ's work, I think you should not object. [b] Hebrews
says that Christ taking on the human body prepared for Him was certainly a part of God's will and therefore work that Christ did on behalf of God -
"Therefore, coming into the world, He says, sacrifice and offering You did not desire, but a body You have prepared for Me." (Hebrews 10:4)
Taking on the human nature and human body which God prepared for Christ was part of Christ's doing the will of the Father -
[including taking His prepared body) to do You will." He takes away the first that He may establish the second, By which will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once and for all." (Hebrews 10:10)
I see no reason to restrict the work of Christ to JUST His redemptive death and not also to His incarnation and human living.
We must adhere to a strick Biblical narrative if we hope to know what God is telling us, otherwise we fall into error.
I think you have come close to falling into error in your criticism.
Your errors could very well be not believing that incarnation caused God to become one with man. Your error could be that you do not believe that to be made "one spirit"
with the Lord Jesus is God making Himself one with at least one part of the Christian's being for a start. A further error from you could be your staggering that the church as the body of Christ is "the Christ"
. And a further possible error is your not acknowledging that Christ's incarnation and human living were part of the work or will of God which Christ came to do.