1. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    24 Jun '16 00:44
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I prefer Hebrews explanation on the word faith it fits well in how God has us walking out
    out lives. It is living out our hope in the full assurance that God is, and that God is a true
    keeper of His word. I will not have a problem with discussing this or anything else as long
    as there is an equal amount of give and take.

    Hebrews 11:1
    Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see.
    God is a true keeper of his word. The problem is that some people are not. Those who choose not to keep their word and live their faith, then there are consequences. Gods keeps his word for all types. Those who keep their word and those who dont.

    Therefore there is a limit to the assistance that Gods Spirit gives to Christian saints. Help is there, but some loose faith and go in a another direction.
  2. R
    Standard memberRemoved
    Joined
    08 Dec '04
    Moves
    100919
    24 Jun '16 14:34
    Faith or Pistis = Trust
  3. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    24 Jun '16 14:35
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    God is a true keeper of his word. The problem is that some people are not. Those who choose not to keep their word and live their faith, then there are consequences. Gods keeps his word for all types. Those who keep their word and those who dont.

    Therefore there is a limit to the assistance that Gods Spirit gives to Christian saints. Help is there, but some loose faith and go in a another direction.
    I'm not sure why this is even a topic of discussion with you we know that from when Jesus
    spoke about the seed and sower. There are going to be those that hear the Word and
    fall away right away, some that will last a little longer, and those the produce fruit. That
    said there is still no excuse to lump those that fall away with the faithful and thereby soil
    both their walk and Jesus' name who identifies with His brethren. Remember what you
    do the least of His you do to Him.

    Matthew 13 New International Version (NIV)

    13 That same day Jesus went out of the house and sat by the lake. 2 Such large crowds gathered around him that he got into a boat and sat in it, while all the people stood on the shore. 3 Then he told them many things in parables, saying: “A farmer went out to sow his seed. 4 As he was scattering the seed, some fell along the path, and the birds came and ate it up. 5 Some fell on rocky places, where it did not have much soil. It sprang up quickly, because the soil was shallow. 6 But when the sun came up, the plants were scorched, and they withered because they had no root. 7 Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants. 8 Still other seed fell on good soil, where it produced a crop—a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown. 9 Whoever has ears, let them hear.”
  4. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    25 Jun '16 00:11
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I'm not sure why this is even a topic of discussion with you we know that from when Jesus
    spoke about the seed and sower. There are going to be those that hear the Word and
    fall away right away, some that will last a little longer, and those the produce fruit. That
    said there is still no excuse to lump those that fall away with the faithful and thereby s ...[text shortened]... duced a crop—a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown. 9 Whoever has ears, let them hear.”
    It is important for you to appreciate that all of these are Christians and some are described by Paul as saints. You seem to think that Christians are automatically destined for the Kingdom of God, but not all are.
  5. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    25 Jun '16 01:261 edit
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    It is important for you to appreciate that all of these are Christians and some are described by Paul as saints. You seem to think that Christians are automatically destined for the Kingdom of God, but not all are.
    I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ, who receive God's
    Spirit, and walk out the remainder of their days following God's lead in their lives, doing
    the good works God had for them to do will without a doubt be REVIELVED as a son of
    God. It isn't so much a matter of destined as God showing who did what He wanted, the
    way He wanted them to do it, in His grace and mercy while filled with His Spirit.

    We are made free by Christ He is the faithful one. There are those that are not true to their
    word, some hide behind religion, some hide behind others evil deeds as if that makes
    them look good, some come up with ways to hide from God in the middle of a life filled
    with religion. None of that hides the fact that God is true and we are not, and because
    there are others that are false it gives us no excuse to not accept God as He calls us to.

    Romans 8:18-19 English Standard Version (ESV)
    18 For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worth comparing with the glory that is to be revealed to us. 19 For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the sons of God.

    Ephesians 5:17-19 English Standard Version (ESV)
    17 Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is. 18 And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit, 19 addressing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody to the Lord with your heart,
  6. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    25 Jun '16 01:53
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ, who receive God's
    Spirit, and walk out the remainder of their days following God's lead in their lives, doing
    the good works God had for them to do will without a doubt be REVIELVED as a son of
    God. It isn't so much a matter of destined as God showing who did what He wanted, the
    way H ...[text shortened]... in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody to the Lord with your heart,
    I think you are adding too much to what the Bible says.

    You keep saying things like this:

    I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ, who receive God's
    Spirit, and walk out the remainder of their days following God's lead in their lives, doing
    the good works God had for them to do will without a doubt be REVIELVED as a son of
    God..


    Quote a reference that supports that sentence.
  7. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    25 Jun '16 13:04
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    I think you are adding too much to what the Bible says.

    You keep saying things like this:

    I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ, who receive God's
    Spirit, and walk out the remainder of their days following God's lead in their lives, doing
    the good works God had for them to do will without a doubt be REVIELVED as a son of
    God..


    Quote a reference that supports that sentence.
    I've not added anything to what the Bible says, I either quote the Bible or explain it never
    once have I added to it. What I've done is no different than you or anyone else who
    expresses an opinion over passages of scripture they are talking about. I will gladly give
    you scripture references that is never an issue if you question something I've said.


    We are given God's Spirit so that we can walk out lives as God wants. If you need more
    reference on this point please ask there are several. With His Spirit God's love has been
    poured into our hearts, if any miss this out pouring there is an issue between them and
    God.


    Matthew 3:11
    “I baptize you with water for repentance, but he who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

    Romans 5:4-6 English Standard Version (ESV)
    4 and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, 5 and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

    Romans 8:4
    in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.



    We are required to walk according to the Spirit not our flesh so if we are not walking out
    our lives by the Spirit we are not going to fulfill the righteous requirements of the law. A
    scripture I've shared with you more than once if you don't have God's Spirit you do not
    belong to God.


    Romans 8:9
    You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him.



    We have God's Spirit as He has given it to us as I told you, and we are walking out our
    lives the reminder of our days following the Spirit's lead as He teaches us about the Lord.
    With the Spirit of God in us we wait till it is shown what we are in Christ. The Holy Spirit
    is Whom by which we are sealed for the day of redemption.


    John 14:26
    But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

    Ephesians 4:30
    And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

    Romans 8:23
    And not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies.

    Romans 8:15
    For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!”
  8. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    25 Jun '16 13:331 edit
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I've not added anything to what the Bible says, I either quote the Bible or explain it never
    once have I added to it. What I've done is no different than you or anyone else who
    expresses an opinion over passages of scripture they are talking about. I will gladly give
    you scripture references that is never an issue if you question something I've said.

    ...[text shortened]... into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!”
    You said basically 4 things.
    1. I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ, who receive God's Spirit,
    2. and walk out the remainder of their days following God's lead in their lives,
    3. doing the good works God had for them to do
    4. will without a doubt be REVIELVED as a son of God..

    Im interested in bible support for 2 and 3. Specifically how does one:
    - follow Gods lead.
    - do the good works God has for them
    Your passages dont seem to tell about that.

    I will tell why I ask. God sent His Son Jesus Christ to tell people how to do the good works God has for them and how to follow Gods lead. Jesus does that in Matt 5,6 and 7, and other parts of the Gospels. Everything in the teachings of Jesus is Gods righteousness, and is the good works God has for us.

    However you, in this thread has suggested that following these teachings of Jesus, means that the person is following a righteousness of their own, instead of following Gods righteousness. How do you arrive at that?

    I dont understand the logic of your doctrine and neither is your doctrine clearly stated by Christ. Please clarify.
  9. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    25 Jun '16 13:40
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    You said basically 4 things.
    1. I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ, who receive God's Spirit,
    2. and walk out the remainder of their days following God's lead in their lives,
    3. doing the good works God had for them to do
    4. will without a doubt be REVIELVED as a son of God..

    Im interested in bible suppo ...[text shortened]... e logic of your doctrine and neither is your doctrine clearly stated by Christ. Please clarify.
    1. No I did not say that "I think" those that turn over their lives to God through Jesus Christ
    who receives God's Spirit.

    I said if you DO NOT have God's Spirit you do not belong to Him, so you BETTER have
    God's Spirit or you are not in God's Kingdom.

    2. If you are not following the Spirit of God in your life you are walking in the flesh, so
    again if you DO NOT have God's Spirit in your life and you are not walking in the Spirit
    during your life from when you met the Lord you are not fulfilling what God requires. I
    already gave you scripture for this!

    3. Yes, God leading by the Holy Spirit is the only way you will do will of God if you are
    not walking in the Spirit you are walking in the flesh and no one pleases God that way.
    Plenty of scripture has been shared with you over this point, and I assume you have
    rejected the scripture for whatever reasons you have.,

    4. I gave scripture you ignored it nothing more can be done for you if you reject the
    Word of God that does not meet your narrow point of view.

    What good is answering your questions if you ignore the answers?
  10. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    25 Jun '16 13:52
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    1. No I did not say that "I think" those that turn over their lives to God through Jesus Christ
    who receives God's Spirit.

    I said if you DO NOT have God's Spirit you do not belong to Him, so you BETTER have
    God's Spirit or you are not in God's Kingdom.

    2. If you are not following the Spirit of God in your life you are walking in the flesh, so
    again ...[text shortened]... t your narrow point of view.

    What good is answering your questions if you ignore the answers?
    This is a copy and paste from your post:

    I think those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ,

    Did you not say I THINK?

    I have to say that it is people like YOU that keep trying to establish your own righteousness.
    Jesus Christ laid out what is Gods righteousness and Christians like YOU reject the teachings of Christ.
  11. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    25 Jun '16 14:41
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    1. No I did not say that "I think" those that turn over their lives to God through Jesus Christ
    who receives God's Spirit.

    I said if you DO NOT have God's Spirit you do not belong to Him, so you BETTER have
    God's Spirit or you are not in God's Kingdom.

    2. If you are not following the Spirit of God in your life you are walking in the flesh, so
    again ...[text shortened]... t your narrow point of view.

    What good is answering your questions if you ignore the answers?
    How does one:
    - follow Gods lead.
    - do the good works God has for them.

    Please explain.
  12. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    25 Jun '16 15:13
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    This is a copy and paste from your post:

    [b]I think
    those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ,

    Did you not say I THINK?

    I have to say that it is people like YOU that keep trying to establish your own righteousness.
    Jesus Christ laid out what is Gods righteousness and Christians like YOU reject the teachings of Christ.[/b]
    I have to rely on Jesus Christ for my own righteousness not my own. I do not reject Jesus
    teachings either. Please give examples of both of these.

    Now I have answered some of your questions, maybe not to satisfaction, but I did the
    best I could. I have a couple of questions for you.

    1. Is the Spirit of God required to belong to God now in this life time?

    2. Can you please God and live a life fulfilling all God requires without the Spirit of God
    in this life time?
  13. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    25 Jun '16 15:14
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    How does one:
    - follow Gods lead.
    - do the good works God has for them.

    Please explain.
    You are supposed to be a believer in God, one of His own and you do not know the
    answer to these questions....SERIOUSLY?
  14. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157646
    25 Jun '16 15:15
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    This is a copy and paste from your post:

    [b]I think
    those that turn their lives over to God through Jesus Christ,

    Did you not say I THINK?

    I have to say that it is people like YOU that keep trying to establish your own righteousness.
    Jesus Christ laid out what is Gods righteousness and Christians like YOU reject the teachings of Christ.[/b]
    You are right, I was wrong in my saying "I think", I should have left that verbiage out of
    my post.
  15. PenTesting
    Joined
    04 Apr '04
    Moves
    247838
    25 Jun '16 15:25
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    How does one:
    - follow Gods lead.
    - do the good works God has for them.

    Please explain.
    I will answer it for you again.

    1. A person follows Gods lead by:
    following the teachings of His Son Jesus Christ

    2. A person does the good works God has for them by:
    following the teachings of His Son Jesus Christ

    Those like YOU KJ who constantly try to reduce, make light of, condemn, ignore the teachings of Jesus by:
    - Fabricating another doctrine
    - Removing Jesus from this dispensation
    - appealing to lesser authorities in the Bible
    - Placing church dogma above Christ
    - calling these teachings 'trying to follow your own righteousness

    .. those like you are false Christians and you and your doctrine are an insult to Jesus Christ.

    The righteousness of God IS JESUS CHRIST.
    Gods good works that he has for Christians IS THE COMMANDMENTS OF CHRIST.
Back to Top

Cookies help us deliver our Services. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Learn More.I Agree