My Briefest Responses

As another normally long-winded poster, I too should take jaywill’s project here to heart. With that sentiment:

The way of continuing transformation just is salvation.

The first step is re-discovering clear-mind awareness, prior to all thoughts and conceptualizations.

In clear-mind awareness, one witnesses reality as it is prior to any of our thinking about it, any of our words or names. One realizes simply that one is also inseparable from that reality.

In clear-mind awareness, one becomes aware also of how all of one’s own thoughts arise from the mind-ground itself, and are either thoughts about the pre-conceptualized reality, or just thoughts about other thoughts, concepts about other concepts, words about other words.

Then one can think as one chooses, without self-confusion, using whatever word-symbols that one finds helpful.

Above all, one will not confuse the ineffable referent with any of the ideas, words and names with which we clothe it.

First rediscover the natural clear-mind awareness and spend sufficient time to become intimate with that way of being aware. Then you will be started on the ever-enrichening way of continual transformation.

I should really do nothing else but to point to that clear mind, over and over, from this angle or that—without any further long-windedness.

Be well, along the way.

Originally posted by vistesd

Above all, one will not confuse the ineffable referent with any of the ideas, words and names with which we clothe it.

"Your Ineffable Reference".

Originally posted by Rajk999
Well youre confusing the issue now Jaywill.
Take it slowly and imagine Im a 10 yr old trying to understand what salvation is about.

We agreed earlier with :

1. Belief & Faith in Jesus
2. Baptism or Being born again into Christ (dying as you put it) or 'putting on' Christ.
3. Works and acts of selfless love to demonstrate that faith.

Now you sa o every rule and trying to use that exception to claim the rule does not apply is dishonest.

Rajk999 said something about me avoiding him.

To remove any thought that I avoided anything here's a reply.

=====================================
As for the thief on the cross, chances are that he was not baptised either. Would that mean that baptism is unimportant as well? There are exceptions to every rule and trying to use that exception to claim the rule does not apply is dishonest.
=========================================

Of course I did not say that baptsim was not important.

I said that the bottom line is that salvation is Jesus Himself.

That is Jesus plus nothing. With Jesus comes eternal life, if we speak here of salvation in terms of eternal life Life = Jesus

"And this is the testimony, that God gave to us eternal life and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life." (1 John 5:11,12)


Beware of Rajk999's twistings to attempt this to appear to teach something that I do not intend, for example "Baptism is not important." Or " living a holy life is not necessary."

Originally posted by jaywill
.. I said that the bottom line is that salvation is [b]Jesus Himself.[/b]

Earlier in this thread you agreed that the essence of salvation lies in :

1. Belief & Faith in Jesus
2. Baptism or Being born again into Christ (dying as you put it) or 'putting on' Christ.
3. Works and acts of selfless love to demonstrate that faith

The first 2 apply to Jesus.
The last #3, is up to YOU. You cannot simply profess your faith in Christ and get salvation. Works is essential. It demonstrates your faith. Christ spoke at length about the importance of works.

Are you changing your mind now?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Earlier in this thread you agreed that the essence of salvation lies in :

1. Belief & Faith in Jesus
2. Baptism or Being born again into Christ (dying as you put it) or 'putting on' Christ.
3. Works and acts of selfless love to demonstrate that faith

The first 2 apply to Jesus.
The last #3, is up to YOU. You cannot simply profess your faith in Ch ...[text shortened]... aith. Christ spoke at length about the importance of works.

Are you changing your mind now?

I do realize that it is pretty hopless to expand your attention span to any larger scope.

I see through you're game. A phony simplicity.


You remind me of the child whose mother says "Eat with your fingers." Then a two years latter she says "Eat with your spoon".

All the child can say is "But YOU TOLD ME to eat with my fingers!"

Development is out of the question. You're stuck on a one note ideology.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
"Your Ineffable Reference".

Nice. 🙂