No True Scotsman

Originally posted by @thinkofone
DG's response is yet another example of how many Christians disingenuously try to deny reality.

The fact remains that the history of Christianity shows that "Christian love" does not preclude racism, homophobia, judging others as unredeemable and pretty much anything else.

Do you think that someone who kidnaps, tortures, rapes and murders an innocent 8 year old girl is filled with the Holy Spirit? Do you even believe in the Holy Spirit? How about "the love of God", then?

Sorry, but I would call that "unredeemable". This is the down side of free will. The good news is that actions and words have consequences. This was this man's free will, not God's, nor "society's". He should face those consequences his society deems necessary. The parents deserve closure as well. People like you would see this man eventually freed to do the same to another little girl. All in the name of "forgiveness".

Originally posted by @suzianne
Do you think that someone who kidnaps, tortures, rapes and murders an innocent 8 year old girl is filled with the Holy Spirit? Do you even believe in the Holy Spirit? How about "the love of God", then?

Sorry, but I would call that "unredeemable". This is the down side of free will. The good news is that actions and words have consequences. This wa ...[text shortened]... s man eventually freed to do the same to another little girl. All in the name of "forgiveness".

What about Martin Luther?

Originally posted by @suzianne
Do you think that someone who kidnaps, tortures, rapes and murders an innocent 8 year old girl is filled with the Holy Spirit? Do you even believe in the Holy Spirit? How about "the love of God", then?

Sorry, but I would call that "unredeemable". This is the down side of free will. The good news is that actions and words have consequences. This wa ...[text shortened]... s man eventually freed to do the same to another little girl. All in the name of "forgiveness".

I honestly don’t believe anyone is beyond redemption and think the Lord chose Saul of Tarsus to bring His Gospel to the Gentiles to illustrate that.

But God’s Holy Spirit indwells someone after they sincerely accept Christ and believe in Him and His Resurrection in their heart - not before.

The person in your example of an unredeemable person obviously did not have God’s Holy Spirit - not just because of the crime you cited, but because if he were unredeemable, he wasn’t saved by definition.

I know you know the last part of what I wrote (and that we just differ on whether someone can be unredeemable) but your reference to the Holy Spirit, I think, was confusing and not what you intended to say. Or maybe I just misunderstood it.

Originally posted by @fmf
"In his book 'On the Jews and their Lies', Martin Luther excoriates [the Jews] as [b]'venomous beasts, vipers, disgusting scum, canders, devils incarnate.' He provided detailed recommendations for a pogrom against them, calling for their permanent oppression and expulsion, writing 'Their private houses must be destroyed and devastated, they could be lodg ...[text shortened]... itism stretching all the way back to Christianity's inception.

Was Martin Luther a Christian?

I think the Holy Spirit’s work on someone in the process known as sanctification is gradual and ongoing. It’s not like a derelict sincerely accepts Christ and becomes a saint the next day. It’d be interesting to know how long Luther had been a Christian when he made those comments.

That said, many Christians from that time period blamed the Jews from that time period for Jesus’ death not realizing...

a) Jesus’ death was God’s will.

b) We are all responsible for Jesus’ death - Jew and Gentile alike - because we are all sinners and He sacrificed Himself for the sins of everyone.

Originally posted by @suzianne
Do you think that someone who kidnaps, tortures, rapes and murders an innocent 8 year old girl is filled with the Holy Spirit? Do you even believe in the Holy Spirit? How about "the love of God", then?

Sorry, but I would call that "unredeemable". This is the down side of free will. The good news is that actions and words have consequences. This wa ...[text shortened]... s man eventually freed to do the same to another little girl. All in the name of "forgiveness".

Seems like you really got confused here. Your post has absolutely nothing to do with what I posted.

Try reading my post again. You should probably also reread the title of this thread.

Originally posted by @fmf
What about Martin Luther?

What about Martin Luther?

In case you didn't notice, I was not responding to you.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Seems like you really got confused here. Your post has absolutely nothing to do with what I posted.

Try reading my post again. You should probably also reread the title of this thread.

And am I supposed to believe that you writing "judging someone unredeemable" was about anyone else but me?

I'm not a moron. I have a college education. I don't need to read your post again. Your problem is that if someone reads one of your posts, they've also read the last 5 posts you've made. Witness this thread. In three posts, you said the exact same thing three times. You think a lot of your own words, never mind the words of Jesus (while he walked the earth). Others simply don't have your appreciation for them because they simply disagree. It's not an invitation to post them again so we can have the pleasure(?) of reading them yet again.

Originally posted by @suzianne
What about Martin Luther?

The thread topic. The OP. Martin Luther.

Originally posted by @suzianne
And am I supposed to believe that you writing "judging someone unredeemable" was about anyone else but me?

I'm not a moron. I have a college education. I don't need to read your post again. Your problem is that if someone reads one of your posts, they've also read the last 5 posts you've made. Witness this thread. In three posts, you ...[text shortened]... s not an invitation to post them again so we can have the pleasure(?) of reading them yet again.

Your "College education" notwithstanding, perhaps if you did read my post again in the context of this thread, you'd realize that not everything is about you.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Your "College education" notwithstanding, perhaps if you did read my post again in the context of this thread, you'd realize that not everything is about you.

That's hysterical, coming from you.

Originally posted by @fmf
The thread topic. The OP. Martin Luther.

Sorry, I'm afraid that I can not move myself to give the tiniest little damn about your OP.

Again, in case you didn't notice, I was not responding to you.

Originally posted by @suzianne
Sorry, I'm afraid that I can not move myself to give the tiniest little damn about your OP.

Why are you posting on this thread then?

Originally posted by @fmf
Why are you posting on this thread then?

She probably didn't realize that you own the thread. 😕

Originally posted by @fmf
Why are you posting on this thread then?

Again, in case you didn't notice, I was not responding to you.

Originally posted by @suzianne
That's hysterical, coming from you.

Seems like there was a time that you operated on a much higher level on this forum than you have been. As it is , you post on the same level as romans, becker, DG, et al.

D64 is correct in her assessment of you. You should reread that as well.

Suzianne typically refuses to examine herself critically, let alone concede any error.
Her posting approach tends to consist of attempted 'proof by tireless reassertion'.
Suzianne likes to repeat her dogmatic statements endlessly without adding evidence or reasoning.

I don't recall that Suzianne often has attempted to build her case by starting with a premise,
citing relevant factual evidence, and applying logical reasoning to arrive at a sound conclusion.
(As I recall, Suzianne has admitted to being weak in logic and mathematics.)