1. Standard memberDasa
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    25 Apr '15 22:11
    The verse below is absolute nonsense.

    "If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire." Revelation 20:15

    Now my question is..................how can people accept this and defend it and believe it.

    Have they lost their minds.

    This is only what false religion would come up with, to put fear into the hearts of the people so as to control their lives and their finances.
  2. Standard memberRJHinds
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    25 Apr '15 22:52
    Originally posted by Dasa
    The verse below is absolute nonsense.

    "If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire." Revelation 20:15

    Now my question is..................how can people accept this and defend it and believe it.

    Have they lost their minds.

    This is only what false religion would come up with, to put fear into the hearts of the people so as to control their lives and their finances.
    The Vedas are from deceiving spirits and contain doctrines of demons.
    Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons

    (1 Timothy 4:1 KJV)

    Every doctrine that denies Christ as the Savior of the world, or that places Him in a subordinate position such as that of some kind of lesser god, is demonic. If you follow demonic teaching it is to your own peril.
    But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

    (Revelation 21:8 KJV)
  3. Standard memberfinnegan
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    25 Apr '15 23:23
    the unspeakable in full pursuit of the uneatable
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    26 Apr '15 02:19
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

    (Revelation 21:8 KJV)[/b]
    An interesting choice of scripture which mentions "all liars". Do you think chess cheats would be included in that group?
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    26 Apr '15 03:101 edit
    Originally posted by Dasa
    The verse below is absolute nonsense.

    "If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire." Revelation 20:15

    Now my question is..................how can people accept this and defend it and believe it.

    Have they lost their minds.

    This is only what false religion would come up with, to put fear into the hearts of the people so as to control their lives and their finances.
    Eternal salvation is decided by God.
    If one's name is written in the book of life then that one will not perish forever in the lake of fire.

    And that is determined by God's authority. We cannot be saved from eternal punishment just because we think we are. Nor can we be unsaved from it just because we think we are.

    Revelation 20:15 is not the only passage on God's salvation. But it is a strong one demonstrating that salvation is not in my hands or your hands. It is absolutely in the hands of God and up to God.
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    26 Apr '15 03:184 edits
    Originally posted by divegeester
    An interesting choice of scripture which mentions "all liars". Do you think chess cheats would be included in that group?
    An interesting choice of scripture which mentions "all liars". Do you think chess cheats would be included in that group?


    It is curious to me. Some posters are strong to remind people that a certain matter was already addressed; already answered. And they remind posters not to use a certain line of reasoning another time.

    But the reminding process seems biased, selective and with much subjectivity of preference.

    This particular line of reasoning, from you I do believe, I already replied to in the past.
  7. SubscriberFMF
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    26 Apr '15 03:231 edit
    Originally posted by sonship
    And [that "salvation" or "damnation"] is determined by God's authority. We cannot be saved from eternal punishment just because we think we are. Nor can we be unsaved from it just because we think we are.
    But isn't obtaining "salvation" by having "faith alone in Christ alone" and choosing to accept the supposed "Grace Gift" simply thinking something about God, simply thinking something about that "Grace Gift", and simply thinking something about oneself?
  8. Standard membersonship
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    26 Apr '15 03:353 edits
    Above I wrote:

    Eternal salvation is decided by God.
    If one's name is written in the book of life then that one will not perish forever in the lake of fire.

    And that is determined by God's authority. We cannot be saved from eternal punishment just because we think we are. Nor can we be unsaved from it just because we think we are.


    The key word I wish to emphasize in this re-write is the word "just" -
    Eternal salvation is decided by God.
    If one's name is written in the book of life then that one will not perish forever in the lake of fire.

    And that is determined by God's authority. We cannot be saved from eternal punishment just because we think we are. Nor can we be unsaved from it just because we think we are.


    The emphasis this time demonstrates that I did not say we cannot be saved because "we think". And I did not say thinking is not involved.

    The point is that if God is not faithful to His own righteous procedures and authority just our thinking cannot save us.

    It is also true of man being saved and his thinking that he is not. If God has saved him, he cannot be unsaved just because he thinks he is not.

    I certainly think I am saved from eternal punishment and thank God. But if it were not up to God's authority and God's faithfulness just me thinking and thanking could not accomplish this eternal salvation.
  9. SubscriberFMF
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    26 Apr '15 03:44
    Originally posted by sonship
    The key word I wish to emphasize in this re-write is the word "just" [etc.]
    My question still stands.
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    26 Apr '15 03:45
    Originally posted by sonship
    This particular line of reasoning, from you I do believe, I already replied to in the past.
    But my post was addressed to RJHinds.
  11. Standard memberDasa
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    26 Apr '15 05:21
    Originally posted by sonship
    Eternal salvation is decided by God.
    If one's name is written in the book of life then that one will not perish forever in the lake of fire.

    And that is determined by God's authority. We cannot be saved from eternal punishment just because we think we are. Nor can we be unsaved from it just because we think we are.

    [b]Revelation 20:15
    ...[text shortened]... salvation is not in my hands or your hands. It is absolutely in the hands of God and up to God.[/b]
    My comment is to highlight an important point........................as follows.

    Christianity rejects re-incarnation which means everyone born to the world is to get only ONE life.

    How on earth can a person be held accountable for his non commitment to Christianity, when many many people have never seen a Bible and who can't read or are retarded or are born into Muslim countries where to reject Islam means death etc?

    On the other hand why are others born into strong Christian families and are well educated and well off with every opportunity to accept and believe in Jesus.

    The answer is .............................that this verse in the Bible is nonsense because it was fabricated centuries ago by pedophile and meat eating ignorant fools.
  12. Standard memberRJHinds
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    26 Apr '15 08:381 edit
    Originally posted by divegeester
    An interesting choice of scripture which mentions "all liars". Do you think chess cheats would be included in that group?
    NO. Do you think the group "unbelievers" includes those that do not believe what Christ has said about everlasting torment in the Lake of Fire and Brimstone?
  13. Standard memberfinnegan
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    26 Apr '15 09:51
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    NO. Do you think the group "unbelievers" includes those that do not believe what Christ has said about everlasting torment in the Lake of Fire and Brimstone?
    Interesting. So "unbelievers" include all those less educated and less able people who are not sufficiently acquainted with the nuances of the text of Revelations and all those very well educated and thoughtful Christians to whom Revelations is an aberration and a distraction, almost certainly the product of a diseased mind horrified into insanity by experience of Nero's vicious treatment of Christians. Really, "unbelievers" probably turns out, by careful slicing of the rules of this game, to include everyone who is not closely associated with a particular, fundamentalist and intolerant branch of modern day Christianity. Agree with us or burn in hell fire.
  14. Standard memberRJHinds
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    26 Apr '15 11:04
    Originally posted by finnegan
    Interesting. So "unbelievers" include all those less educated and less able people who are not sufficiently acquainted with the nuances of the text of Revelations and all those very well educated and thoughtful Christians to whom Revelations is an aberration and a distraction, almost certainly the product of a diseased mind horrified into insanity by exper ...[text shortened]... mentalist and intolerant branch of modern day Christianity. Agree with us or burn in hell fire.
    Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

    (2 Timothy 2:15 KJV)
  15. Standard membersonship
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    26 Apr '15 12:043 edits
    Originally posted by Dasa
    My comment is to highlight an important point........................as follows.



    Christianity rejects re-incarnation which means everyone born to the world is to get only ONE life.


    I thought re-incarnation means it is possible for one to RE - somehow as another life. That is more the impression I have been given.

    Consequently, I hear of crossing over even from animal to man in another life or from human to animal in another life.



    How on earth can a person be held accountable for his non commitment to Christianity,


    Let me interrupt right there. Strictly speaking the passage that you referred to mentioned no religion. It mentioned "the book of life".

    God could have had John write - "and if anyone one was not found in Christianity ...". But it mentions "the book of life" .

    I don't know how this impresses any other Christians. But it impresses me that the passage really says that God has the absolute final word.

    I may not know ALL the way in which one's name may appear to be written in "the book of life" . What I do know is this -

    " That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved." (Rom. 10:9)

    So I know for certain that confessing Jesus as Lord and believing in Him being the raised from the dead Lord will result in one's name being written in the book of life. I may not know exhaustively of all the factors which will cause God to write one's name in "the book of life" . The one way in which He commands, believing in the Son of God, receiving Him as the Lord, is what we should obey.

    I leave room for some unknowns that are known only to God, between Romans 10:9 and ... "And if anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.".

    I also know that no one comes to the Father except through Jesus Christ. But "Christianity" is not mentioned in that passage either. Jesus is mentioned.


    when many many people have never seen a Bible and who can't read or are retarded or are born into Muslim countries where to reject Islam means death etc?


    I don't know all answers to these kinds of questions.
    But I would be more concerned for someone like yourself.
    You have heard the Gospel.
    You have to come to grips with whether you will receive the Son of God or not.

    Most of the people who point out situations like this are not IN that situation themselves. And rationalizing away about this should not be an excuse for you not to repent to believe in Christ the Son of God.


    On the other hand why are others born into strong Christian families and are well educated and well off with every opportunity to accept and believe in Jesus.


    The following passage may suggest that for one who has never heard of the name of Jesus, God knows or possibly responds to them believing in God the Creator.

    "And to you who are being afflicted, rest with us at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with the angels of His power, in flaming fire,

    Rending vengeance to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Who will pay the penalty of eternal destruction ..." (2 Thess. 1:7-9a)


    Some teach that there are two catagories of guilty persons here:

    1.) Those who do not know God.
    2.) Those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    I think there must be something to this because in Romans Paul speaks of people being without excuse to disbelieve [edited] that God exists.

    I am Christian who believes that there are some unknowns to me.
    What I teach is that we obey what we do know and not fight against that which God has made plan.

    Your situation and my situation is that we should confess Jesus as Lord and believe that God has raised Him from the dead. For no one comes to the Father based on his own merit. Without standing on the merit of the Son of God I don't know how we can be accepted by a holy God who is only please by the perfect life of His Son.


    The answer is .............................that this verse in the Bible is nonsense because it was fabricated centuries ago by pedophile and meat eating ignorant fools.


    This sounds like idolatry. It sounds like you have an idol of nonmeat and you are exalting that above God. This is vanity. Don't exalt vegetarianism above God.

    Can you exalt vegetables above God ?
    You should "eat" or take into your being Jesus for the real eating.

    You should be more concerned to "eat" or take into your heart the Lord Jesus Christ as Savior. Definitely your name will then be written in the book of life without question, without ambiguity.
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