25 Jan 12
Originally posted by twhitehead
Do you mean intuition has no logic to it? Or do you mean without following a logical process?
Yes to both.
If you have ever read the brilliant book "Blink!" you will know what an important part the sub-conscious mind (which is incapable of logical thought!) plays in solving problems and generating new ideas.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by googlefudgeWhat does " fuzzy logic " mean ? It is a term used in studies of A. I. Surely fuzzy logic is an example of a-logical thinking.Another term used in programming is " an ill structured problem ". I say that the search for Ultimate Reality/ Truth / God is an ill structured problem not amenable to an algorithm composed of logical statements. We require an out of box thinking while dealing with this ill structured problem. That is what humanity has been trying to do all these years.
Well for starters the idea that different halves of the brain do different things (ie being left
brained or right brained being artistic or logical respectively) is total nonsense.
Thinking is either logical, ie it follows the laws of logic, or it is illogical, it doesn't follow the
laws of logic. There is no in between ground.
That isn't to sa ...[text shortened]... tropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StrawVulcan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLgNZ9aTEwc
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by NickstenBriefly, Dr Francis Collins is a brilliant scientist who was appointed to head the Human Genome Project, arguably the largest and most ambitious biochemistry project ever undertaken.
I have had a quick scroll through the site...tell me a bit more please.
He was also a confirmed atheist.
As he studied the complex, yet simple and beautiful, sequencing of genes on the DNA string, he became a believer in a Creator and Designer.
However, certain aspects of the analysis of DNA made him very uncomfortable with the simple creationist view that "God created it all in six days". He saw evidence of evolution that he could not argue away. (I mentioned some of this in a previous thread, "OPINIONS vs FACTS")
Hence he started the "Biologos Foundation", which seeks to encourage debates and discussion among serious scientists as well as interested lay people that seek to understand evolution without having to reject God.
If you can lay your hands on the book "The Language of God", you would really find it interesting. Otherwise, go to the website and read some of the Introductory material.
Blessings!
CJ
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by CalJustMany thanks for your support ! All that I am saying is that Humanity is saddled with the problem of finding out what is the Ultimate Reality / Truth / God and which problem requires many different approaches incl.a-logical thinking. All saints, poets and visionaries all over the world have used a-logical approaches.Many of them have realized God.
Hi rvsakhadeo,
I can feel for your sincere efforts in trying to get some right-brain thinking through to all these materialistic tunnel thinkers!
Once somebody makes the categorical statement that EVERYTHING around us can be understood and explained by materialistic processes, or at least by processes that can be understood by us [i] at our current le ...[text shortened]... ll protest: How can you say that? Prove the value of mythology! etc etc My response? Poor you!)
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by CalJustI disagree. The sub-concious mind is perfectly capable of logical thought. It couldn't solve problems or generate new ideas without it. Maybe you define 'logic' different from the rest of us.
If you have ever read the brilliant book "Blink!" you will know what an important part the sub-conscious mind (which is incapable of logical thought!) plays in solving problems and generating new ideas.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by twhiteheadIn my experience, i.e. in the interchanges between us, I have found this to be true - you are indeed very willing to share your knowledge, but rather less willing to listen and consider somebody else's ideas!
At least I am willing to share my knowledge, unlike some apparently who just like to act superior.
😕
25 Jan 12
1 edit
Originally posted by twhiteheadI disagree.
Of course you do! How could it be otherwise!
The sub-concious mind is perfectly capable of logical thought. It couldn't solve problems or generate new ideas without it.
How would you know?
If you can read your sub-conscious mind, by definition you are not!!
Maybe you define 'logic' different from the rest of us.
Well, I'm not sure about the rest of us. But most probably it's different from yours!
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by CalJustThat is not the only way to know.
How would you know?
If you can read your sub-conscious mind, by definition you are not!!
Well, I'm not sure about the rest of us. But most probably it's different from yours!
Well that explains it then. Maybe you should define it before continuing or we will just be talking at cross purposes. Or do you think that it is a useful type of a-logical thinking to be discussing something where neither knows what the other is saying because they are speaking a different language?
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by CalJustI am willing to consider other peoples ideas if they are willing to explain them in terms I am able to understand. Simply announcing that I am incapable of understanding your superior ideas makes me think instead that you are fully aware that your ideas are nonsensical and would rather not discuss them for that reason. Its like the way threads go silent whenever certain topics come up eg the soul, the definition of 'supernatural'.
In my experience, i.e. in the interchanges between us, I have found this to be true - you are indeed very willing to share your knowledge, but rather less willing to listen and consider somebody else's ideas!
😕
You notice how I have pointed out multiple times on this thread that 'supernatural' is illogical by definition by nobody has challenged that? 'Supernatural' is a word people use when they don't want to be questioned, when they want to be able to say "but it doesn't follow your logic" whenever someone points out a problem.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by CalJustNo I wasn't referring to Dasa. I was referring to your fellow Christian Nicksten. Is he a "nutcase" too for suggesting that teachers of conventional science are "child abusers", no different from those who abuse children physically, who "must be locked away forever"?
If you are referring to Dasa's statement concerning "child abusers" you already know what I think of Dasa - complete nutcase and not worthy of any serious response.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by NickstenEvolution is a fact Nicksten, it's a scientific fact as much as that the earth orbits the sun. It is backed up by 150 years of scientific discoveries using the scientific method from a whole host of scientific disciplines.
Universally would include everybody right? Even if not the case, it doesn't mean that because it is accepted "universally" it is the truth. I can use the very same argument towards Christianity and you will differ from me. There are just as many theists as there are atheists, I would even assume the balance more towards theists. Thus my argument can be that there is a better chance of God to exist than the evolution theory.
That you have never read a book on the subject does not surprise me, it's a theme which runs through every creationist who posts on this site. Coincidence?! I think not. That you always seem to conflate the big bang with evolution says it all. Whether God exists or not, doesn't hinge on whether you accept evolution. Talk to CalJust, a Christian who also accepts the evidence for evolution, it's not as black and white as you're making it out to be.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by CalJustNo need to apologise for going off on a tangent, this is what these threads do. 🙂
Hi PK,
I was just questioning the logic of letting children "make up their own mind" about religion, and not about health, where they receive (or at least should receive) guidance and encouragement from parents.
Bottom line is that we tend to replicate ourselves and our own world view - and that is not bad or wrong.
Raising children that are AWARE, ...[text shortened]... we in fact mold their young minds in our image (for good or bad) from the very earliest age.
My gripe was about Nicksten threatening to remove his children from school if they are ever taught anything about evolution. It has been by experience from debating numerous Christians, including Nicksten, on this board over the years that their stance is based on ignorance and fear. I was questioning why his children should be subjected to his own ignorance and fear and not allowed to attend biology classes and make their own minds up for themselves.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by twhiteheadYou notice how I have pointed out multiple times on this thread that 'supernatural' is illogical by definition by nobody has challenged that? 'Supernatural' is a word people use when they don't want to be questioned, when they want to be able to say "but it doesn't follow your logic" whenever someone points out a problem.
Hulloooooo! Notice the name of this Forum? Spirituality!!
Spirituality presupposes and accepts the Supernatural, or spiritual world.
It is a given. we don't have to explain it!
(It should go without saying, but in your case it probably does not, that there are a myriad interpretations of Spirituality, and beliefs, which make this forum interesting, or at least some of it.)
Of course, if you want to continue to ridicule it and say we are all idiots, then that is your prerogative - free speech, and all that.
However, what DOES intrigue me (and I have said this before) what on earth are YOU doing here if you don't believe in any kind of spiriuality? Simply to take the mickey and poke fun at us?
What would you say if I went to the CHESS Forum and said: you guys are all idiots, why don't you play checkers instead??
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by FMFOf course not.
No I wasn't referring to Dasa. I was referring to your fellow Christian Nicksten. Is he a "nutcase" too for suggesting that teachers of conventional science are "child abusers", no different from those who abuse children physically, who "must be locked away forever"?
I referred to Dasa because this idea originated from him.
Nicksten is eager but ill-informed. If he follows some clues that have been laid for him, he may yet get some answers for his questions.
25 Jan 12
Originally posted by Proper Knobsigh, its nowhere near a scientific fact, there is no empirical scientific evidence which
Evolution is a fact Nicksten, it's a scientific fact as much as that the earth orbits the sun. It is backed up by 150 years of scientific discoveries using the scientific method from a whole host of scientific disciplines.
That you have never read a book on the subject does not surprise me, it's a theme which runs through every creationist who posts ...[text shortened]... epts the evidence for evolution, it's not as black and white as you're making it out to be.
demonstrates the transmutation of one species into another, none! Adaptation is not
mutation and never has been, yet the materialist would have us believe that they are
one and the same. That entities adapt is without question, that they adapt and
transom themselves into an entirely different organism is the stuff of pure fantasy.