Our present suffering

NIV Romans 8
18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed.

Unless someone disagrees and you may, I am taking that the term this
present suffering is for the lives we are currently living not the one to
come. Having said that, two things quickly come to mind for me given the
current discussions on this board.

First being that the creation is waiting for the revealing of the sons of
God, and the second that they/we who belong to God will see the glory of
God revealed when the sons of God are revealed. It will be God's glory
not the glory of mankind that God could take sinners like us and turn us
into sons of God.

Originally posted by KellyJay
NIV Romans 8
18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed.

Unless someone disagrees and you may, I am taking that the term this
present suffering is for the lives we are currently living not the one to ...[text shortened]... ory
not the glory of mankind that God could take sinners like us and turn us
into sons of God.

Some questions:

Paul was writing to the church in Rome at a time of harsh persecution; on what basis do you think that is comparable to today?

Who and what are "the sons of God"?

How do the "discussions on this board" indicate that we are waiting for the sons of God to be revealed? And how do these discussions also indicate that when they are revealed, god's glory will be revealed? Both related to the "discussions on this board".

Thanks.

Originally posted by divegeester
Some questions:

Paul was writing to the church in Rome at a time of harsh persecution; on what basis do you think that is comparable to today?

Who and what are "the sons of God"?

How do the "discussions on this board" indicate that we are waiting for the sons of God to be revealed? And how do these discussions also indicate that when they are re ...[text shortened]... aled, god's glory will be revealed? Both related to the "discussions on this board".

Thanks.

Christians are persecuted all over the earth, mainly in fundamentalist Islamic countries.

Originally posted by whodey
Christians are persecuted all over the earth, mainly in fundamentalist Islamic countries.

How does your statement apply to the OP and specifically in relation to "discussions on this board"?

Originally posted by divegeester
How does your statement apply to the OP and specifically in relation to "discussions on this board"?

You asked if the persecution Paul experienced was comparable to that of today.

I say yes.

The sufferings of this present age are used by God to assist Him in working Christ into His people. This sufferings, which we neither have to ask for or seek for, will come. Learning to let such discomfort turn us to enjoy Christ causes God to wrought into our souls Christ.

A very simple way to cooperate with this process is by praising and thanking God in all of our daily circumstances, many of which are toublesome and a suffering.

No minor discomfort is insignificant. And of course heavier ones can do a strong job to turn us to Christ. But to praise Him with thanksgiving in our discomfort results in the increase of Christ and the gaining of Christ.

Now consider the classic song "Blessed Assurance" . Please notice that this wise classic hymn has the chorus saying:

"This is my story, this is my song,
Praising my Savrior all the day long." Right?

But notice the second verse begins this way:

"Perfect submission ..."

What the author meant is that to PRAISE God in all of our circumstances is "perfect submission." This is the thought - to give thanks to the Savior throughout the day. Come this things or that thing - "the sufferings of the present time" we exercise our faith in thanks and praise. This is perfect submission to the sovereignty of God.

Here it is:

"Perfect submission, all is at rest.
I and my Savior are happy and blessed."

Perfect submission means we TRUST the Lord and can PRAISE Him in all of our daily circumstances. And this submitting to God in trust that He knows what best we need, wrought Christ into our being. This invisible Person wrought into our personality will on that day be manifested in our glorification.

It very much depends on the attitude and calibration of the heart towards trusting Christ, submitting to His arrangment, thankiing and praising Him in our circumstances.

" ... joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him that we may also be glorified with Him.

Glorification and its degree is dependent, conditional - IF ... we suffer with Him. We cannot avoid suffering in this life. For the Christian the issue is do we "suffer with Him?".

Having said this, there is much else to say. We do not have to accept EXTRAS from the enemy of God. In our suffering we should praise God for what is of His allowance and His providence. But if there is anything extra added on by Satan, this we should reject and ask God to stop.

" For I consider that the sufferings of this present time re not worthy to be compared with the coming glory to be revealed upon us." (v.18)

Cont. below.

So, basically a thread about nothing.

Originally posted by KellyJay
NIV Romans 8
18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed.

Unless someone disagrees and you may, I am taking that the term this
present suffering is for the lives we are currently living not the one to ...[text shortened]... ory
not the glory of mankind that God could take sinners like us and turn us
into sons of God.

NIV Romans 8
18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed.

If creation is awaiting for the children of God to be revealed, to me it stands to reason that
right now they are not. This doesn't mean they are not here, or that they are not already
children of God, it just means that they have yet to be revealed.

Looking a little earlier in Romans we see this.

8:1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering.And so he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Those who are not in Christ Jesus, those who do not have God's Spirit, cannot fully meet
the requirements unless they have God's Spirit. They can do the requirements with effort,
BUT they will never fully meet them outside of God. It is all to God's glory we are saved,
not due to our own efforts, or works least any of us boast before God. I'm sure there will
efforts made by some telling others how bad they are and how good they are, but unless
you are found in Christ Jesus it doesn't matter how good you think you are or how good
you are, you will fall short compared to the righteousness of God.

"4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit."

Originally posted by whodey
Christians are persecuted all over the earth, mainly in fundamentalist Islamic countries.

How would you quantify this problem?