26 Mar '10 15:37

Originally posted by josephw
Romans 1:19,20

[b]Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

I have used this verse many times in her ...[text shortened]... heart was darkened.[/b]

But according to the atheists we are the ones that are delusional![/b]

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Romans 1:19,20

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

I have used this verse many times in here but have never gotten a response from the atheists.

The atheist wants evidence. Creation itself is evidence. The evidence is "manifest" in them.
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Sorry, that I have not been more engaging in this particular thread.

Because I believe Romans I have to agree with you completely. Creation testifies that there is a God to the human conscience. People who claim that they know within that there is no God I simply have to regard God's word over their word. They must be mistaken or decieved or just insisting on telling us what they want us to hear.

The Bible says some people hold down the truth in unrighteousness and what can be known about God's eternal power and divine characteristics can be known through the things made.

This does not bring a person into fellowship with God however. It informs them that there is a God. They still may have no communion with God, no fellowship with God, and so for all practical purposes God seems not to exist to them.

Subjectively, they do not touch God within because the God substantiating spirit is comatose, deadened, and needs still to be born of God through faith in Jesus.

But I agree that creation testifies to the human conscience that there is a supreme Creator.

The eternal gospel preached during the great tribulation is a gospel concerning God the Creator alone.

"And I say another angel flying in mid-heaven, having an eternal gospel to announce to thosee dwelling on the earth, even to every nation and tribe and tonuge and people,

Saying with a loud voice, Fear God and give Him glory because the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who has made heaven and earth and the sea and the springs of waters. " (Rev. 14:6,7)

The eternal gospel, which will be preached during the time of the great tribulation (Matt. 24:21), differs from the gospel of grace (Acts 20:24) preached in the church age.

The basic contents of the gospel of grce are repentence unto God and faith in the Lord Jesus (Acts 20:21) that people may be forgiven of their sins and be born again as the children of God (Luke 24:47; John 1:12). But the contents of the eternal gospel in Revelation 14 are that people should fear God and worship God (the Creator as we've seen in Romans 1), that they may not be deceived and follow Antichrist. This eternal gospel of the supreme Creator who made the heven and earth (v.7) is aimed to bring man back to the genuine worship of the only Creator God.

Only man is priviledged to preach the gospel of grace on the earth todday (Acts 10:3-6). But the eternal gospel will be preached by an angel in the air at the close of the church age.

At some time during the great tribulation the angel will announce from the air "Fear God and give Him glory" in contrast to the Antichrist proclaiming that he is God.

This proclaimation of the eternal gospel from the air by an angel will counter the false prophet's deceit that says men should follow Antichrist and neutralizes the deth threat against those who refuse to worship Antichrist during the great tribulation (Rev. 13:14-15).

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Romans 1:21

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

But according to the atheists we are the ones that are delusional!
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Yes, you can see the vain imaginations taking over in the unbelieving society.

Escapes of fancy into multiple universes, multiple dimensions of all kinds are often desperate measures to avoid acknowledging God's existence. Attempts to find the cause of the universe within itself often are measures used to avoid acknowledging God's existence.

But the Father desires more than man's objective acknolwedgment that there is a God, although this is a start. He desires intimate fellowship and communion in a divine and human mingling and oneness.

So Paul says that the fallen man is not only alienated from the knowledge about God's existence. He is more so "alienated from the life of God" (Eph. 4:18). This indicates the relationship man was created for was that God would live in man and mingle His divine uncreated life with man's created life.

That is that we would possess not only our human created life but the very life of God in His Son Jesus Christ. He who has the Son has the life.

But certainly the first step is to realize that God does exist and the creation proves that to us.

Spirituality

Proof that god exists