Originally posted by sonship
[quote] [b] " But in all these things we more than conquer through Him who loved us.

For I am persuaded that neither death nor life nor angels nor principalities nor things present nor things to come nor powers nor height nor depth nor any other creature will be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." (Rom. 8:37-39) ...[text shortened]... us Christ into us, and with Jesus pouring out the divine love into our hearts who receive Jesus.

This what you stated : Paul was persuaded. You need to be persuaded too.
"In Christ Jesus" the Holy Spirit is given to be with the saved - FOREVER ( John 14:16) . And nothing, no way, no how, can separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus.

1.) The Holy Spirit is given to the saved person.

2.) With the Holy Spirit the love of God is poured out into their hearts.

3.) Nothing in all the universe can separate them from this love.

is all misinformation, deceit and outright lies.

First : Here is the actual quote

If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; (John 14:15-16 KJV)

Jesus says keep his commandments and he will send the Comfortor. Nowhere does the Bible ever state your #1.

Your #2 is not in the Bible either. Judas Iscariot was one of the 12 and he turned out to be evil and lived contrary to God. Did he have the Holy Spirit and the love of God? NO. Not all those who possess the Holy Spirit will please God.

Your #3 is also nonsense. People are separated from the love of God through their evil deeds .. like Judas Iscariot, Annanias and Saphira .. those who continue in sin separate themselves from God.

Here Jude explains:

But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ; How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit. But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life. (Jude 1:17-21 KJV)

See if you can figure out how the Christian can keep himself in the love of God. It is not an automatic process and neither is it permanent. The Christian has to work, and live righteously and follow the commandments in order to keep in Gods love.

Originally posted by Rajk999
This what you stated : [i]Paul was persuaded. You need to be persuaded too.
[b]"In Christ Jesus" the Holy Spirit is given to be with the saved - FOREVER ( John 14:16) . And nothing, no way, no how, can separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus.

1.) The Holy Spirit is given to the saved person.

2.) With the Holy Spirit the love of God is poured out into their hearts.

3.) Nothing in all the universe can separate them from this love. [/i]

is all misinformation, deceit and outright lies.

First : Here is the actual quote

If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; (John 14:15-16 KJV)

Jesus says keep his commandments and he will send the Comfortor. Nowhere does the Bible ever state your #1.

Rajk999 is wrong:

Ephesians 1:13 says

"In whom [Christ] you also having heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, in Him also believing, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of the promise,

Who [the Holy Spirit] is the pledge of our inheritance unto the redemption of the acquired possession, to the praise of His glory." (Eph. 1:13,14)

The saved HEARD the word of the truth.
The saved BELIEVED the gospel.
The saved were SEALED by the Holy Spirit of the promise.

Definitely, by hearing and believing the Gospel of Christ the Holy Spirit came to them and SEALED them.

For how long is the sealing ?
Is the sealing temporary ?
Is the sealing only until they make failure or sin # 35 ?

The sealing is all the way "until the day of redemption of the acquired possession". This means unto the resurrection and transfiguration of the physical body.

The matured saved person who will be rewarded at the millennium is SEALED unto the day of redemption.

The less matured saved person who still needs correction, discipline, chastizement when Jesus returns also is SEALED unto the day of redemption.

The teaching is not a license to remain a sinful person.
But the teaching is also not untrue because some saved will overcomers and some will be defeated in their spiritual maturation.

The Holy Spirit is given to every saved one as a SEAL the the promise of the Gospel sooner or latter will be fully theirs.

If the Holy Spirit is not given "UNTO THE DAY OF REDEMPTION" then let Rajk999 explain "UNTO" what ALTERNATIVE moment is He given to the saved ?

Since the transfiguration of the body does not END the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, Ephesians is only confirming John 14:16,17 . The Spirit will be with the believers UNTO the resurrection and transfiguration of the body and on until eternity. So He will be with the disciples FOREVER.

"And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Comforter, that He may be with you FOREVER, even the Spirit of reality ..." (John 14:16,17a)

Your #2 is not in the Bible either. Judas Iscariot was one of the 12 and he turned out to be evil and lived contrary to God. Did he have the Holy Spirit and the love of God? NO. Not all those who possess the Holy Spirit will please God.

On the day Jesus breathed into the disciples "the Holy Spirit", Judas Iscariot was no there. In the closed and locked room on the day of Christ's resurrection, Jesus came to the 10 (not 12) disciples and they were the first to receive the Holy Spirit.

Whoever was there, we know Judas was not there and Thomas was not there (v.24).

" When therefore it was evening on that day, the first day of the week, and while the doors were shut where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst and said to them, Peace be to you. (v.19)

Then Jesus said to them again, Peace be to you, as the Father has sent Me, i also send you.

And when He had said this, He breathed into them and said to them, Receive the Holy Spirit." (vs. 21,22)

Where was Judas Isacariot ? Jesus had foretold that this disciple was to perish because he would be the son of perdition. This He had foretold previously in chapter 17 before His crucifixion and resurrection.

" When I was with them, I kept them in Your name, which You have given to Me, and I guarded them.; and not one of them perished, except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. " (John 17:12)

All the original 12 disciples were saved, including Thomas the last doubting one. But Judas Isacariot betrayed Jesus and became the perishing "son of perdition".

Beware the Rajk999 doesn't twist this truth also.

" ... and not one of them perished, except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled."

Your #3 is also nonsense. People are separated from the love of God through their evil deeds .. like Judas Iscariot, Annanias and Saphira .. those who continue in sin separate themselves from God.

As you can see Paul the author of 13 of the 27 books of the New Testament was persuaded, but Rajk999 the heretic and author of umpteen nonsensical Internet posts is not persuaded.

He points to the instance of Annanias and Saphira whom the Holy Spirit dealt with in such a discipline that they died.

To Rajk999 this can only mean that they were not sealed by the Holy Spirit forever.
To this man's thinking, no one with the Holy Spirit forever can ever be disciplined by God for a sin.

There simply is no room in his head for God saving people forever yet still perfecting them with any amount of necessary discipline He uses for their perfecting.

It doesn't do any use to show him in the Bible God disciplines His sons that they may be perfected in sanctification once having been saved. He is blinded and cannot see it.

For example Hebrews 12:1-29 is one part of the New Testament carefully telling of how God will use many means along a long latitude of possibilities to perfect to maturity His own sons.

It is not only in the church age God may perfect His sons. It is also during the millennial kingdom God will do so before the eternal age of the new heaven and the new earth.

I will deal with the King James translation of Jude 17-21 latter today probably.

But first as a preliminary remark it is important to see I am not condoning or excusing much less encouraging the terrible behavior of those whom are talked about in Jude 17-21.

Rajk999 is incapable of thinking that one persuaded of the assurance of eternal life
might equally teach the need of subjective sanctification.

Two of the three criticisms are refuted above.

Originally posted by sonship
..There simply is no room in his head ...

There is no room in my head for your deceit and lies because it is full of the commandments of Christ, and I thank God for that.

Your head has a lot of room to absorb false doctrines because you stubbornly refused to fill it with what Jesus said and preached.

TYPO. The number 12 should be 11

All the original 11 [edited] disciples were saved, including Thomas the last doubting one. But Judas Iscariot betrayed Jesus and became the perishing "son of perdition".

sonship

Originally posted by sonship

TYPO

The word "until" should be "unto".

The sealing is all the way "unto [edited] the day of redemption of the acquired possession". This means unto the resurrection and transfiguration of the physical body.