The Muslim Jesus

Originally posted by whodey
Do I love you? You know I do. After all, I love you enough to take the time a trouble to show you what I percieve as the truth.

Speaking of being a good follower of Jesus, do you love me? Do you love your enemies? Did Mohammad love his enemies? Does Allah love his enemies?

You didn't answer my questions, why do you reject my interpretation?



Talking about love, as you know the concept of love is different!!!!

You know I do. After all, I love you enough to take the time a trouble to show you what I percieve as the truth.

It is hard to believe that, every time I read how you talk about Muslims and don't feel you love me, or any other Muslim. Love is not just word, it is an act.

do you love me?

What do you think? I have some affection to you. I want the good for you, and for every one else. And as long as you don't start attacking me you are not my enemy, and the same affection is there for you.

Do you think if I hate you I will waste my time with you as well to show you the truth as I see it.

Do you love your enemies?
We discussed that before, no one with logic will love someone raising a gun to his head to kill him. You faild to answer this question before.


Did Mohammad love his enemies?
He didn't have enemies for himself, and start any one with enmity, so those who choosed to fight him , where enemies of Allah, and when he had power over them, he forgave them all.

Does Allah love his enemies?
Allah don't love those who died choosing not to believing in him, rejecting him, and his prophets. (how do you think he will send them to hell while loving them). Those who are still a life, still under the mercy of Allah, and if they choose to believe they will be forgiven. But of course he don't like their bad deeds.
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I hope you can waste some more time to watch the video....

Originally posted by ahosyney
You didn't answer my questions, why do you reject my interpretation?



Talking about love, as you know the concept of love is different!!!!

[b]You know I do. After all, I love you enough to take the time a trouble to show you what I percieve as the truth.

It is hard to believe that, every time I read how you talk about Muslims and don't fe ...[text shortened]... ----------------------------

I hope you can waste some more time to watch the video....[/b]

Before talking about love it would behoove one to first define what is meant by love. What is your definition?

Originally posted by ahosyney
Do you love your enemies?
We discussed that before, no one with logic will love someone raising a gun to his head to kill him. You faild to answer this question before.

So I assume that the Biblical account of Jesus chastising Peter for drawing a sword to defend him when they came to take him to the cross is incorrect? Either that or Jesus would have to be illogical, no? In fact, he was seen as healing the man that Peter struck with the sword who had come to take him away to murder him!!

I think you are to quick to say it is illogical to love your enemies. In fact, it seemed to work very well for the early christians. The early church was martyred continuously yet they did not render evil for evil by fighting back. You would think such a game plan is suicidal but the religion spread like wild fire despite this. Crazy huh?

Originally posted by ahosyney
Did Mohammad love his enemies?
He didn't have enemies for himself, and start any one with enmity, so those who choosed to fight him , where enemies of Allah, and when he had power over them, he forgave them all.

This is a curious statement. You say that when Mohammad has power over his enemies that he then forgave them all. Is Mohammad better than Allah who has power over his enemies but chooses not to forgive them all? Must one have "power" over their enemies in order to love them?

Originally posted by ahosyney
It is hard to believe that, every time I read how you talk about Muslims and don't feel you love me, or any other Muslim. Love is not just word, it is an act.

Love does not mean that you agree with someone, rather, loving someone means that you deal with them respectfully. I feel as though I have done this and if I have not in the past I apologize. After all, you challenge people you see such as myself as deviating from the truth because you care about them, no? I do the same.

Originally posted by whodey
Love does not mean that you agree with someone, rather, loving someone means that you deal with them respectfully. I feel as though I have done this and if I have not in the past I apologize. After all, you challenge people you see such as myself as deviating from the truth because you care about them, no? I do the same.

Good post.

Is anyone, including ahoy, going to comment on the video?

Posting links to long videos or essays without comment is not effective in getting the message across to anyone but "the choir". It's disrespectful to the audience.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
Is anyone, including ahoy, going to comment on the video?

Posting links to long videos or essays without comment is not effective in getting the message across to anyone but "the choir". It's disrespectful to the audience.

I'm sorry of this shows disrespect to you are anyone, I apologise for every one who feel that I disrespect him. I just wanted to share something with you people.

You asked me where Quran talks about Jesus: I will give you all the references. If you have time you can read them. Of course there is much details as those found in the Bible, and they are not in sequence. So I will put them in their order in the Quran. Also note in Quran Jusus name is Iesa, and his mother name is Maryam (Arabic names). Also note that the translation I use has some extra words added to explain the meaning of the verse (like commentary), and it will always between two dashes like this "- ... -" .

1- (Nobel-Translation)(Al-Baqarah, 2)

(87. And indeed, We gave Mûsa -Moses- the Book and followed him up with a succession of Messengers. And We gave 'Iesa -Jesus-, the son of Maryam -Mary-, clear signs and supported him with Rûh-ul-Qudus -Jibrael -Gabriel--. Is it that whenever there came to you a Messenger with what you yourselves desired not, you grew arrogant? Some, you disbelieved and some, you killed. )

(253. Those Messengers! We preferred some to others; to some of them Allâh spoke -directly-; others He raised to degrees -of honour-; and to 'Iesa -Jesus-, the son of Maryam -Mary-, We gave clear proofs and evidences, and supported him with Rûh-ul-Qudus -Jibrael -Gabriel--. If Allâh had willed, succeeding generations would not have fought against each other, after clear Verses of Allâh had come to them, but they differed - some of them believed and others disbelieved. If Allâh had willed, they would not have fought against one another, but Allâh does what He likes. )


2- (Nobel-Translation)(Aal-Imran 3) - In this Sura (Chapter) the story of mary and her grow in the temple is mentioned (I don't think you will find it in the Bible)

(35. -Remember- when the wife of 'Imrân said: "O my Lord! I have vowed to You what -the child that- is in my womb to be dedicated for Your services -free from all worldly work; to serve Your Place of worship-, so accept this, from me. Verily, You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knowing." )

(36. Then when she delivered her -child Maryam -Mary--, she said: "O my Lord! I have delivered a female child," - and Allâh knew better what she delivered, - "And the male is not like the female, and I have named her Maryam -Mary-, and I seek refuge with You -Allâh- for her and for her offspring from Shaitan -Satan-, the outcast." )

(37. So her Lord -Allâh- accepted her with goodly acceptance. He made her grow in a good manner and put her under the care of Zakariyâ -Zachariya-. Every time he entered Al-Mihrâb to -visit- her , he found her supplied with sustenance. He said: "O Maryam -Mary-! From where have you got this?" She said, "This is from Allâh." Verily, Allâh provides sustenance to whom He wills, without limit." )

(38. At that time Zakariyâ -Zachariya- invoked his Lord, saying: "O my Lord! Grant me from You, a good offspring. You are indeed the All-Hearer of invocation." )

(39. Then the angels called him, while he was standing in prayer in Al-Mihrâb -a praying place or a private room-, -saying-: "Allâh gives you glad tidings of Yahya -John-, confirming -believing in- the Word from Allâh -i.e. the creation of 'Iesa -Jesus-, the Word from Allâh -"Be!" - and he was!--, noble, keeping away from sexual relations with women, a Prophet, from among the righteous." )

(40. He said: "O my Lord! How can I have a son when I am very old, and my wife is barren?" Allâh said: "Thus Allâh does what He wills." )

(41. He said: "O my Lord! Make a sign for me." Allâh said: "Your sign is that you shall not speak to mankind for three days except with signals. And remember your Lord much -by praising Him again and again-, and glorify -Him- in the afternoon and in the morning." )

(42. And -remember- when the angels said: "O Maryam -Mary-! Verily, Allâh has chosen you, purified you -from polytheism and disbelief-, and chosen you above the women of the 'Alamîn -mankind and jinns- -of her lifetime-." )

(43. O Mary! "Submit yourself with obedience to your Lord -Allâh, by worshipping none but Him Alone- and prostrate yourself, and Irkâ'i -bow down etc.- along with Ar-Râki'ûn -those who bow down etc.-." )

(44. This is a part of the news of the Ghaib -unseen, i.e. the news of the past nations of which you have no knowledge- which We inspire you with -O Muhammad -. You were not with them, when they cast lots with their pens as to which of them should be charged with the care of Maryam -Mary-; nor were you with them when they disputed. )

(45. -Remember- when the angels said: "O Maryam -Mary-! Verily, Allâh gives you the glad tidings of a Word -"Be!" - and he was! i.e. 'Iesa -Jesus- the son of Maryam -Mary-- from Him, his name will be the Messiah 'Iesa -Jesus-, the son of Maryam -Mary-, held in honour in this world and in the Hereafter, and will be one of those who are near to Allâh." )

(46. "He will speak to the people in the cradle and in manhood, and he will be one of the righteous." )

(47. She said: "O my Lord! How shall I have a son when no man has touched me." He said: "So -it will be- for Allâh creates what He wills. When He has decreed something, He says to it only: "Be!" and it is. )

(48. And He -Allâh- will teach him -'Iesa -Jesus-- the Book and Al-Hikmah -i.e. the Sunnah, the faultless speech of the Prophets, wisdom, etc.-, -and- the Taurât -Torah- and the Injeel -Gospel-. )

(49. And will make him -'Iesa -Jesus-- a Messenger to the Children of Israel -saying-: "I have come to you with a sign from your Lord, that I design for you out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allâh's Leave; and I heal him who was born blind, and the leper, and I bring the dead to life by Allâh's Leave. And I inform you of what you eat, and what you store in your houses. Surely, therein is a sign for you, if you believe. )

(50. And I have come confirming that which was before me of the Taurât -Torah-, and to make lawful to you part of what was forbidden to you, and I have come to you with a proof from your Lord. So fear Allâh and obey me. )

ahosyney Say:- I think verse 50 is refereing to the fulfillment of the law, but Christians missunderstand it -

(51. Truly! Allâh is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him -Alone-. This is the Straight Path. )

(52. Then when 'Iesa -Jesus- came to know of their disbelief, he said: "Who will be my helpers in Allâh's Cause?" Al-Hawâriûn -the disciples- said: "We are the helpers of Allâh; we believe in Allâh, and bear witness that we are Muslims -i.e. we submit to Allâh-." )

(53. Our Lord! We believe in what You have sent down, and we follow the Messenger -'Iesa -Jesus--; so write us down among those who bear witness -to the truth i.e. Lâ ilâha ill-Allâh - none has the right to be worshipped but Allâh-. )

(54. And they -disbelievers- plotted -to kill 'Iesa -Jesus--, and Allâh planned too. And Allâh is the Best of the planners. )

(55. And -remember- when Allâh said: "O 'Iesa -Jesus-! I will take you and raise you to Myself and clear you -of the forged statement that 'Iesa -Jesus- is Allâh's son- of those who disbelieve, and I will make those who follow you -Monotheists, who worship none but Allâh- superior to those who disbelieve -in the Oneness of Allâh, or disbelieve in some of His Messengers, e.g. Muhammad , 'Iesa -Jesus-, Mûsa -Moses-, etc., or in His Holy Books, e.g. the Taurât -Torah-, the Injeel -Gospel-, the Qur'ân- till the Day of Resurrection. Then you will return to Me and I will judge between you in the matters in which you used to dispute." )

(56. "As to those who disbelieve, I will punish them with a severe torment in this world and in the Hereafter, and they will have no helpers." )

(57. And as for those who believe -in the Oneness of Allâh- and do righteous good deeds, Allâh will pay them their reward in full. And Allâh does not like the Zâlimûn -polytheists and wrong-doers-. )

(58. This is what We recite to you -O Muhammad - of the Verses and the Wise Reminder -i.e. the Qur'ân-. )

(59. Verily, the likeness of 'Iesa -Jesus- before Allâh is the likeness of Adam. He created him from dust, then -He- said to him: "Be!" - and he was. )

(60. -This is- the truth from your Lord, so be not of those who doubt. )

(61. Then whoever disputes with you concerning him -'Iesa -Jesus-- after -all this- knowledge that has come to you, -i.e. 'Iesa -Jesus-- being a slave of Allâh, and having no share in Divinity- say: -O Muhammad - "Come, let us call our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves - then we pray and invoke -sincerely- the Curse of Allâh upon those who lie." )

I will continue in next posts.

3- (Nobel-Translation)(An-Nisaa 4)

(155. Because of their breaking the covenant, and of their rejecting the Ayât -proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.- of Allâh, and of their killing the Prophets unjustly, and of their saying: "Our hearts are wrapped -with coverings, i.e. we do not understand what the Messengers say-" - nay, Allâh has set a seal upon their hearts because of their disbelief, so they believe not but a little. )

(156. And because of their -Jews- disbelief and uttering against Maryam -Mary- a grave false charge -that she has committed illegal sexual intercourse-; )

(157. And because of their saying -in boast-, "We killed Messiah 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-, the Messenger of Allâh," - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of 'Iesa -Jesus- was put over another man -and they killed that man-, and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no -certain- knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not -i.e. 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary- -: )

(158. But Allâh raised him -'Iesa -Jesus-- up -with his body and soul- unto Himself -and he is in the heavens-. And Allâh is Ever All­Powerful, All­Wise. )


And in later location .....


(171. O people of the Scripture -Jews and Christians-! Do not exceed the limits in your religion, nor say of Allâh aught but the truth. The Messiah 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-, was -no more than- a Messenger of Allâh and His Word, -"Be!" - and he was- which He bestowed on Maryam -Mary- and a spirit -Rûh- created by Him; so believe in Allâh and His Messengers. Say not: "Three -trinity-!" Cease! -it is- better for you. For Allâh is -the only- One Ilâh -God-, Glory be to Him -Far Exalted is He- above having a son. To Him belongs all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And Allâh is All­Sufficient as a Disposer of affairs. )

(172. The Messiah will never be proud to reject to be a slave to Allâh, nor the angels who are near -to Allâh-. And whosoever rejects His worship and is proud, then He will gather them all together unto Himself. )

(173. So, as for those who believed -in the Oneness of Allâh - Islâmic Monotheism- and did deeds of righteousness, He will give their -due- rewards, and more out of His Bounty. But as for those who refuse His worship and were proud, He will punish them with a painful torment . And they will not find for themselves besides Allâh any protector or helper.)

4- (Nobel-Translation)(Al-Maidah 5)

(72. Surely, they have disbelieved who say: "Allâh is the Messiah -'Iesa -Jesus--, son of Maryam -Mary-." But the Messiah -'Iesa -Jesus-- said: "O Children of Israel! Worship Allâh, my Lord and your Lord." Verily, whosoever sets up partners in worship with Allâh, then Allâh has forbidden Paradise for him, and the Fire will be his abode . And for the Zâlimûn -polytheists and wrong­doers- there are no helpers. )

(73. Surely, disbelievers are those who said: "Allâh is the third of the three -in a Trinity-." But there is no ilâh -god- -none who has the right to be worshipped- but One Ilâh -God -Allâh-. And if they cease not from what they say, verily, a painful torment will befall the disbelievers among them. )

(74. Will they not repent to Allâh and ask His Forgiveness? For Allâh is Oft­Forgiving, Most Merciful. )

(75. The Messiah -'Iesa -Jesus--, son of Maryam -Mary-, was no more than a Messenger; many were the Messengers that passed away before him. His mother -Maryam -Mary-- was a Siddiqah -i.e. she believed in the words of Allâh and His Books -see Verse 66:12--. They both used to eat food -as any other human being, while Allâh does not eat-. Look how We make the Ayât -proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.- clear to them, yet look how they are deluded away -from the truth-. )

(76. Say -O Muhammad to mankind-: "How do you worship besides Allâh something which has no power either to harm or to benefit you? But it is Allâh Who is the All­Hearer, All­Knower." )

(77. Say -O Muhammad -: "O people of the Scripture -Jews and Christians-! Exceed not the limits in your religion -by believing in something- other than the truth, and do not follow the vain desires of people who went astray in times gone by, and who misled many, and strayed -themselves- from the Right Path." )[i]

And in later location ....


[i](110. -Remember- when Allâh will say -on the Day of Resurrection-. "O 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-! Remember My Favour to you and to your mother when I supported you with Rûh­ul­Qudus -Jibrael -Gabriel-- so that you spoke to the people in the cradle and in maturity; and when I taught you writing, Al­Hikmah -the power of understanding-, the Taurât -Torah- and the Injeel -Gospel-; and when you made out of the clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My Permission, and you breathed into it, and it became a bird by My Permission, and you healed those born blind, and the lepers by My Permission, and when you brought forth the dead by My Permission; and when I restrained the Children of Israel from you -when they resolved to kill you- since you came unto them with clear proofs, and the disbelievers among them said: 'This is nothing but evident magic.' " )

ahosyney say: Note the miracles of Jesus is somwhow different.

(111. And when I -Allâh- put in the hearts of Al-Hawârîeen -the disciples- -of 'Iesa -Jesus-- to believe in Me and My Messenger, they said: "We believe. And bear witness that we are Muslims." )

(112. -Remember- when Al-Hawârîûn -the disciples- said: "O 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-! Can your Lord send down to us a table spread -with food- from heaven?" 'Iesa -Jesus- said: "Fear Allâh, if you are indeed believers." )

(113. They said: "We wish to eat thereof and to be stronger in Faith, and to know that you have indeed told us the truth and that we ourselves be its witnesses." )

(114. 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-, said: "O Allâh, our Lord! Send us from heaven a table spread -with food- that there may be for us - for the first and the last of us - a festival and a sign from You; and provide us sustenance, for You are the Best of sustainers." )

(115. Allâh said: "I am going to send it down unto you, but if any of you after that disbelieves, then I will punish him with a torment such as I have not inflicted on anyone among -all- the 'Alamîn -mankind and jinns-." )

(116. And -remember- when Allâh will say -on the Day of Resurrection-: "O 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-! Did you say unto men: 'Worship me and my mother as two gods besides Allâh?' " He will say: "Glory be to You! It was not for me to say what I had no right -to say-. Had I said such a thing, You would surely have known it. You know what is in my inner­self though I do not know what is in Yours, truly, You, only You, are the All­Knower of all that is hidden and unseen. )

(117. "Never did I say to them aught except what You -Allâh- did command me to say: 'Worship Allâh, my Lord and your Lord.' And I was a witness over them while I dwelt amongst them, but when You took me up, You were the Watcher over them, and You are a Witness to all things. -This is a great admonition and warning to the Christians of the whole world-. )

(118. "If You punish them, they are Your slaves, and if You forgive them, verily You, only You are the All­Mighty, the All­Wise ." )

(119. Allâh will say: "This is a Day on which the truthful will profit from their truth: theirs are Gardens under which rivers flow -in Paradise- - they shall abide therein forever. Allâh is pleased with them and they with Him. That is the great success -Paradise-. )

Continue in the next post ...

Originally posted by ahosyney
3- (Nobel-Translation)(An-Nisaa 4)

(155. Because of their breaking the covenant, and of their rejecting the Ayât -proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.- of Allâh, and of their killing the Prophets unjustly, and of their saying: "Our hearts are wrapped -with coverings, i.e. we do not understand what the Messengers say-" - nay, Al ...[text shortened]... aradise-. )

Continue in the next post ...

tell them of this: From the Koran:

The Disbelievers
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

[109.1] Say: O unbelievers!
[109.2] I do not serve that which you serve,
[109.3] Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.4] Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
[109.5] Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.6] You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

5- (Nobel-Translation)(At-Tawba)

(30. And the Jews say: 'Uzair -Ezra- is the son of Allâh, and the Christians say: Messiah is the son of Allâh. That is a saying from their mouths. They imitate the saying of the disbelievers of old. Allâh's Curse be on them, how they are deluded away from the truth! )

6- (Nobel-Translation)(Maryam 19)

(16. And mention in the Book -the Qur'ân, O Muhammad , the story of- Maryam -Mary-, when she withdrew in seclusion from her family to a place facing east. )

(17. She placed a screen -to screen herself- from them; then We sent to her Our Ruh -angel Jibrael -Gabriel--, and he appeared before her in the form of a man in all respects. )

(18. She said: "Verily! I seek refuge with the Most Beneficent -Allâh- from you, if you do fear Allâh." )

(19. -The angel- said: "I am only a Messenger from your Lord, -to announce- to you the gift of a righteous son." )

(20. She said: "How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, nor am I unchaste?" )

(21. He said: "So -it will be-, your Lord said: 'That is easy for Me -Allâh-: And -We wish- to appoint him as a sign to mankind and a mercy from Us -Allâh-, and it is a matter -already- decreed, -by Allâh-.' " )

(22. So she conceived him, and she withdrew with him to a far place -i.e. Bethlehem valley about 4-6 miles from Jerusalem-. )

(23. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a date-palm. She said: "Would that I had died before this, and had been forgotten and out of sight!" )

(24. Then -the babe 'Iesa -Jesus- or Jibrael -Gabriel-- cried unto her from below her, saying: "Grieve not! Your Lord has provided a water stream under you; )

(25. "And shake the trunk of date-palm towards you, it will let fall fresh ripe-dates upon you." )

(26. "So eat and drink and be glad, and if you see any human being, say: 'Verily! I have vowed a fast unto the Most Beneficent -Allâh- so I shall not speak to any human being this day.'" )

(27. Then she brought him -the baby- to her people, carrying him. They said: "O Mary! Indeed you have brought a thing Fariya -an unheard mighty thing-. )

(28. "O sister -i.e. the like- of Hârûn -Aaron- -not the brother of Mûsa -Moses-, but he was another pious man at the time of Maryam -Mary--! Your father was not a man who used to commit adultery, nor your mother was an unchaste woman." )

(29. Then she pointed to him. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?" )

(30. "He -'Iesa -Jesus-- said: Verily! I am a slave of Allâh, He has given me the Scripture and made me a Prophet;" )

(31. "And He has made me blessed wheresoever I be, and has enjoined on me Salât -prayer-, and Zakât, as long as I live." )

(32. "And dutiful to my mother, and made me not arrogant, unblest. )

(33. "And Salâm -peace- be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!" )

(34. Such is 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-. -it is- a statement of truth, about which they doubt -or dispute-. )

(35. It befits not -the Majesty of- Allâh that He should beget a son -this refers to the slander of Christians against Allâh, by saying that 'Iesa -Jesus- is the son of Allâh-. Glorified -and Exalted be He above all that they associate with Him-. When He decrees a thing, He only says to it, "Be!" and it is. )

(36. -'Iesa -Jesus- said-: "And verily Allâh is my Lord and your Lord. So worship Him -Alone-. That is the Straight Path. -Allâh's Religion of Islâmic Monotheism which He did ordain for all of His Prophets-." -Tafsir At-Tabarî- )

(37. Then the sects differed -i.e. the Christians about 'Iesa -Jesus--, so woe unto the disbelievers -those who gave false witness by saying that 'Iesa -Jesus- is the son of Allâh- from the meeting of a great Day -i.e. the Day of Resurrection, when they will be thrown in the blazing Fire-. )



7- (Nobel-Translation)(Az-Zukhruf 43)

(63. And when 'Iesa -Jesus- came with -Our- clear Proofs, he said: "I have come to you with Al-Hikmah -Prophethood-, and in order to make clear to you some of the -points- in which you differ, therefore fear Allâh and obey me, )

(64. "Verily, Allâh! He is my Lord -God- and your Lord -God-. So worship Him -Alone-. This is the -only- Straight Path -i.e. Allâh's religion of true Islâmic Monotheism-." )

(65. But the sects from among themselves differed. So woe to those who do wrong -by ascribing things to 'Iesa -Jesus- that are not true- from the torment of a painful Day -i.e. the Day of Resurrection-! )
[i]

7- (Nobel-Translation)(As-Saff 61)

[i] (6. And -remember- when 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-, said: "O Children of Israel! I am the Messenger of Allâh unto you confirming the Taurât --Torah- which came- before me, and giving glad tidings of a Messenger to come after me, whose name shall be Ahmed . But when he -Ahmed i.e. Muhammad - came to them with clear proofs, they said: "This is plain magic." )

and later.....

(14. O you who believe! Be you helpers -in the Cause- of Allâh as said 'Iesa -Jesus-, son of Maryam -Mary-, to Al­Hawârîûn -the disciples-: "Who are my helpers -in the Cause- of Allâh?" Al­Hawârîeen -the disciples- said: "We are Allâh's helpers" -i.e. we will strive in His Cause!-. Then a group of the Children of Israel believed and a group disbelieved. So We gave power to those who believed against their enemies, and they became the uppermost. )

I think that is all, I hope I did answer your question...

That is what the video say if anyone is interested.

Originally posted by whodey
Love does not mean that you agree with someone, rather, loving someone means that you deal with them respectfully. I feel as though I have done this and if I have not in the past I apologize. After all, you challenge people you see such as myself as deviating from the truth because you care about them, no? I do the same.

I know you don't agree with me, and I didn't ask you to agree with me to show love to me.

Every one say Muslims are bad people because some who claim to be Muslims did bad things. You belame me, my religion and the prophet for the actions of people who don't know their religion. And you say you love me.

But I never said all Christians are bad because of the actions of Christians in which is full of blood as many knows. I never did that. I alwayes talk with about the faith and the basics of your believes, and you always talk about bad Muslims and what they do , and use this to fight my fiath. I don't think this is fair , and I don't think it is a sign of love as well.

I have that I explaine my Idea.

Originally posted by frogstomp
tell them of this: From the Koran:

The Disbelievers
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

[109.1] Say: O unbelievers!
[109.2] I do not serve that which you serve,
[109.3] Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.4] Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
[109.5] Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
[109.6] You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

Thank you for posting this Sura (Chapter), but I didn't understand what do you mean by doing that. What I understand is you want me to follow the last verse:

[109.6] You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

Is that correct?

Originally posted by ahosyney
Thank you for posting this Sura (Chapter), but I didn't understand what do you mean by doing that. What I understand is you want me to follow the last verse:

[b][109.6] You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

Is that correct?[/b]

close enough

Originally posted by frogstomp
close enough

Also Quran Say,

(Nobel-Translation)(An-Nahl)

(125. Invite -mankind, O Muhammad - to the Way of your Lord -i.e. Islâm- with wisdom -i.e. with the Divine Inspiration and the Qur'ân- and fair preaching, and argue with them in a way that is better. Truly, your Lord knows best who has gone astray from His Path, and He is the Best Aware of those who are guided.)

So I follow this verse first, and I try as much as I can to use wisdom!!!!

But if didn't work out then I should follow ,

(Nobel-Translation)(Al-Kafirun)

(6. "To you be your religion, and to me my religion -Islâmic Monotheism-." )

Also not that Sura Al Kafirun (disbelievers) was a reply from Allah to disbelievers when they offered the prophet to follow their religion one day and they follow his religion (Islam) one day, thinking that it is a way to take him a way from his message. So the replay was for them and any one who think the same way , that it is not a game.

Regards