The Purpose of Religion

Originally posted by RBHILL
Because we are all sinners and God doesn't want sin in his presents in heaven, so you or Jesus will have to pay for your sins.

That's not an answer; it's just another baseless assertion. Why would it bother an all powerful, all knowing God to have "sin" (whatever that would mean to such a deity) in his "presence" (isn't He present everywhere)? Why would he want "vile" "depraved" creatures like humans in his glorious presence in the first place?

Originally posted by Nemesio
Thich Nhat Hahn does not eschew religious ritual. He says that one who has reached the
esoteric stage of spirituality can still find fulfillment in what ostensibly seems as exoteric
religion.
He opines that once a person reaches the level of mindfulness which can detach the
fundamentalist trappings from the positive, spiritual aspects of religion, experiencing that
ritual can reinforce spirituality.

i think that i would agree with this. however, what does Thich Nhat Hahn say about practicing religious ritual before one has reached the esoteric stage of spirituality? i think such rituals can be counterproductive because they can force existing ideas onto people and effectively deter individual spiritual growth.

for example, my parents attend catholic services, and on occasion, i tag along with them. during the services, there are times when the entire congregation stands and recites in unison the catholic creeds. as an example, one of the recitations runs substantively like this (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11049a.htm):


"We believe (I believe) in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, and born of the Father before all ages. (God of God) light of light, true God of true God. Begotten not made, consubstantial to the Father, by whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven. And was incarnate of the Holy Ghost and of the Virgin Mary and was made man; was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate, suffered and was buried; and the third day rose again according to the Scriptures. And ascended into heaven, sits at the right hand of the Father, and shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead, of whose Kingdom there shall be no end. And (I believe) in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and Giver of life, who proceeds from the Father (and the Son), who together with the Father and the Son is to be adored and glorified, who spoke by the Prophets. And one holy, catholic, and apostolic Church. We confess (I confess) one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for (I look for) the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come. Amen."


so there they all are, just reciting from rote memory like a bunch of droning robots. many of them are young children who have memorized the creeds from bible school. maybe i am just cynical, but it always makes me wonder how many of them are actually paying any thought at all to what they are saying. i wonder if some of the children present even comprehend all of the words they are saying. i wonder if these children have ever even been exposed to any other opposing viewpoints besides those put forth in these creeds. i don't see how it would be healthy to take the fundamental beliefs of your faith and ritualize them in such a way that you end up going through the motions -- saying them just to say them.

i also know the creeds by heart -- only because i have heard them so many times during service. when i'm standing there and everyone around me is reciting, it's hard not to feel some obligation to join in. i can't help but think that those children in the congregation who are under the stern watchful eyes of their parents feel obligated.

Originally posted by Coletti
I associate that sound with tail wagging. Good doggy.

Sounds like Coletti's tongue is wagging to me...