1. Joined
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    06 Nov '15 11:591 edit
    http://www.usmessageboard.com/threads/atheist-okay-to-disparage-christians-but-islam-off-limits-because-of-fear.453243/

    (CNSNews.com) – An atheist professor said Tuesday that it’s acceptable to criticize Christians but not Muslims, because he does not “fear” retaliation from Christians.

    “I know what keeps me from critiquing Islam on my blog is just fear,” Phil Zuckerman said at a discussion on religious liberty at Georgetown University in Washington, D.C. “I’ve got three kids.

    “So I know I can say anything about Christianity or Mormonism, and I’m not living in fear, which is a testament to Christianity and Mormonism, and that’s wonderful. Thank you,” said Zuckerman, who is a self-described atheist and professor of secular studies at Pitzer College in Claremont, Calif.

    Zuckerman was a panelist at the discussion as part of Georgetown University’s Religious Freedom Project at its Berkley Center.

    Kirsten Powers, a Democratic pundit, recent convert to Catholicism and author of the book “How the Left Is Killing Free Speech,” said at the event that she does not understand why Muslims can oppose same-sex marriage and not be targeted by the Left for it, but calling out Christians for their beliefs is acceptable.

    Powers cited the hidden video recordings made earlier this year by Steven Crowder, who asked Muslim bakers in Michigan if they would bake a cake for a same-sex wedding and they refused.

    “If these had been Christian bakeries, it would have been on the front page of the New York Times, so I’m wondering why we’re able to have this amicable, disagreement with Muslims for having this view,” Powers said. “Why are we not able to do that with Christians?

    “I absolutely agree with you,” Zuckerman said.

    “I absolutely agree that it is okay for those on the left to critique, mock, deride Christianity, but Islam gets a free pass, which is so strange, because if you care about women’s rights, if you care about human rights, if you care about gay rights, then really Islam is much more problematic – sorry to paint Islam with a huge brush – and much more devastating,” he said.

    “As an atheist – where on planet Earth is the death penalty meted out to atheists?” Zuckerman said. “It’s only in, I think, 24 Muslim countries.

    “Where have human rights flourished the most? In Christian nations,” he said.

    “I see Christianity as a great friend of secular culture,” Zuckerman said. “I see Islam as much more of a threat, much more debilitating. I’m not talking about Muslim individuals that I happen to sit next to on an airplane or are my neighbors. I’m talking about doctrines and those that have the power to enforce those doctrines in the form of Sharia law.”

    Zuckerman mentioned comedian Bill Maher, actor Ben Affleck and atheist and author Sam Harris and the reaction to their remarks about Islam.

    “I would say two things,” Zuckerman said. “I know what keeps me from critiquing Islam on my blog is just fear.

    “I’ve got three kids,” he said. “So I know I can say anything about Christianity or Mormonism, and I’m not living in fear, which is a testament to Christianity and Mormonism, and that’s wonderful. Thank you.

    “I would never write the same kind of stuff that I do about certain religions – Judaism, Christianity, LDS, whatever – as I would about Islam – just straight up fear,” Zuckerman said.
  2. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Nov '15 13:13
    Originally posted by whodey
    “As an atheist – where on planet Earth is the death penalty meted out to atheists?” Zuckerman said. “It’s only in, I think, 24 Muslim countries.
    It's appalling, even without taking the true figure and doubling it for effect.

    "In 13 countries around the world, all of them Muslim, people who openly espouse atheism or reject the official state religion of Islam face execution under the law, according to a detailed study issued on Tuesday." (Reuters 2013) ~ Afghanistan, Iran, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritania, Nigeria, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, United Arab Emirates and Yemen. In the country where I live, atheists can be imprisoned.

    As a matter of interest, what do you think your country should do about it?
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    06 Nov '15 18:39
    Originally posted by FMF
    It's appalling, even without taking the true figure and doubling it for effect.

    "In 13 countries around the world, all of them Muslim, people who openly espouse atheism or reject the official state religion of Islam face execution under the law, according to a detailed study issued on Tuesday." (Reuters 2013) ~ Afghanistan, Iran, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritani ...[text shortened]... an be imprisoned.

    As a matter of interest, what do you think your country should do about it?
    "As a matter of interest, what do you think your country should do about it?"

    About what? Do you mean curtail religious expression? Or continue to uphold its citizen's right to freedom of worship?
  4. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Nov '15 19:41
    First they whine and moan that the US puts their nose in other nations' business. Now they "want something done" about this, that happens to affect *them*, and they apparently think it's "appalling" that we're not "doing something" about it.
  5. SubscriberProper Knob
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    06 Nov '15 20:07
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    First they whine and moan that the US puts their nose in other nations' business. Now they "want something done" about this, that happens to affect *them*, and they apparently think it's "appalling" that we're not "doing something" about it.
    I asked you this in another thread, maybe you missed it. Are you dense?
  6. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    06 Nov '15 20:14
    Originally posted by Proper Knob
    I asked you this in another thread, maybe you missed it. Are you dense?
    I believe we all have density sir.
  7. Cape Town
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    06 Nov '15 20:21
    Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
    I believe we all have density sir.
    Even airheads have some density.
  8. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Nov '15 23:34
    Originally posted by josephw
    About what? Do you mean curtail religious expression? Or continue to uphold its citizen's right to freedom of worship?
    About the issue laid out in the OP.
  9. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Nov '15 23:36
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    First they whine and moan that the US puts their nose in other nations' business. Now they "want something done" about this, that happens to affect *them*, and they apparently think it's "appalling" that we're not "doing something" about it.
    I don't know who you mean exactly by "they". But the question remains: what do you think your country should do about the fact that atheists can be executed for their non-belief in Afghanistan, Iran, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritania, Nigeria, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, United Arab Emirates and Yemen?
  10. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Nov '15 23:55
    Originally posted by whodey
    “As an atheist – where on planet Earth is the death penalty meted out to atheists?” Zuckerman said. “It’s only in, I think, 24 Muslim countries. “Where have human rights flourished the most? In Christian nations,” he said.
    Do you think that countries like the US and the UK should ~ for example ~ have diplomatic relations with the 13 countries that have laws on their books that allow for the execution of people for being atheists?

    In a country with a predominantly Christian electorate - like the US - do its politicians stand to lose or gain [ i.e. domestically... "...all politics is locals politics"... etc.] by making the human rights issues surrounding the treatment of atheists a priority in their dealings with other countries?
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    07 Nov '15 00:06
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    First they whine and moan that the US puts their nose in other nations' business. Now they "want something done" about this, that happens to affect *them*, and they apparently think it's "appalling" that we're not "doing something" about it.
    Who is 'they'?

    Is the 'They' who "whine[s] and moan[s] that the US [intervenes in other countries]" the same
    'They' who thinks that the USA should do something about religious persecution around the world?

    Furthermore, is it not possible to criticise the USA's [and the west's generally] ham fisted and ill
    thought out recent series of wars and 'interventions' while at the same time believe that 'interventions'
    that are well considered can be both effective and desirable?

    Is it unreasonable to criticise a country that gets very upset at supposed 'Christian' persecution while
    at the same time it ignores persecution of anyone else?

    Finally, did you think at all before posting or did you knee-jerk anti-atheist instinct just override all thought?
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    07 Nov '15 00:08
    Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
    I believe we all have density sir.
    Ahh, but while we are all dense, some are denser than others.
  13. Joined
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    07 Nov '15 00:36
    Originally posted by FMF
    I don't know who you mean exactly by "they". But the question remains: what do you think your country should do about the fact that atheists can be executed for their non-belief in Afghanistan, Iran, Malaysia, Maldives, Mauritania, Nigeria, Pakistan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Sudan, United Arab Emirates and Yemen?
    Fight the PC police regarding speaking the truth and be couragous in speaking the truth even at the possible risk of death
  14. SubscriberFMF
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    07 Nov '15 01:19
    Originally posted by whodey
    Fight the PC police regarding speaking the truth and be couragous in speaking the truth even at the possible risk of death
    [1] So, no action against the countries in question?

    [2] What would be the elements and stages of this fight you propose?
  15. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    07 Nov '15 01:35
    Executing atheists would surely have some support in the US.
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