1. Standard memberRajk999
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    22 Apr '17 11:591 edit
    In the thread "Why are Christians so secretive ?", which was polluted with irrelevant nonsense by Kelly J mostly [figures as he is not able to properly address this issue, or any issue for that matter from what I see he writes] the only attempt to answer the question came from Whodey who said:

    Christ was revolutionary in that he told his followers to talk directly wit God by calling him "Father"

    The question is Christians believe that a relationship with Jesus Christ is the crux of their salvation. Can someone explain what this relationship entails.

    Whodeys attempt at an answer does not get to the heart of the matter. Does calling God, Father mean a relationship exists? What does someone have to do or say or believe to have a relationship with God / Christ?

    Son-in-law of Roigam [😀], Kelly J, and others like sonship etc, seem not to be able to reply. If any Christian, or atheist [🙂], can answer it would be appreciated.
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    22 Apr '17 12:14
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    In the thread "Why are Christians so secretive ?", which was polluted with irrelevant nonsense by Kelly J mostly [figures as he is not able to properly address this issue, or any issue for that matter from what I see he writes] the only attempt to answer the question came from Whodey who said:

    [i]Christ was revolutionary in that he told his followers to t ...[text shortened]... not to be able to reply. If any Christian, or atheist [🙂], can answer it would be appreciated.
    I don't believe that "relationship" stuff.
    Just putting that out there in case anyone is interested.
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    22 Apr '17 12:16
    What I would like to know is why roigam spontaneously and seemly with rhyme, reason or humour, claimed that josephw is married to his daughter?
  4. Standard memberRajk999
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    22 Apr '17 12:18
    Originally posted by divegeester
    I don't believe that "relationship" stuff.
    Just putting that out there in case anyone is interested.
    Glad to hear that. I believe that the relationship idea exists in the Bible but it certainly not how they describe it.

    Whodey says calling God Father means a relationship .. or something along those lines.

    Josephw calling Roigam Father in Law, does not mean a relationship exists 😀
  5. Standard memberRajk999
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    22 Apr '17 12:241 edit
    Originally posted by divegeester
    What I would like to know is why roigam spontaneously and seemly with rhyme, reason or humour, claimed that josephw is married to his daughter?
    I think the reason for his doing that, and josephw responding so negatively is the one and same reason. They both have communication issues [mostly likely caused by religious disagreements] and roigam is trying to embarrass him into talking.
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    22 Apr '17 12:36
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    I think the reason for his doing that, and josephw responding so negatively is the one and same reason. They both communication issues [mostly likely caused by religious disagreements] and roigam is trying to embarrass him into talking.
    Oh, how disappointing. It would be much more fun if it were true.
  7. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    22 Apr '17 14:21
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    In the thread "Why are Christians so secretive ?", which was polluted with irrelevant nonsense by Kelly J mostly [figures as he is not able to properly address this issue, or any issue for that matter from what I see he writes] the only attempt to answer the question came from Whodey who said:

    [i]Christ was revolutionary in that he told his followers to t ...[text shortened]... not to be able to reply. If any Christian, or atheist [🙂], can answer it would be appreciated.
    I don't see how a gnat can have a relationship with an elephant, irrespective of what parental language the gnat uses.
  8. Standard memberRajk999
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    22 Apr '17 22:08
    Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
    I don't see how a gnat can have a relationship with an elephant, irrespective of what parental language the gnat uses.
    Weak and powerful,. or big and small creatures have relationships all the time. Just that the terms are skewed in favour of the more powerful one. In the case of God and humans, God / Christ dictates what this relationship entails.

    The bible mentions nothing about any relationship with God/Christ, so it is a manmade doctrine, and it appears that churches and pastors are making this stuff up as they go along. It has become such a common doctrine that Christians now claim that there is no eternal life unless you have a relationship with Christ.

    Funny how nobody wants to explain what it entails. Im beginning to think that they dont even know themselves.
  9. Standard memberRemoved
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    22 Apr '17 22:40
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    In the thread "Why are Christians so secretive ?", which was polluted with irrelevant nonsense by Kelly J mostly [figures as he is not able to properly address this issue, or any issue for that matter from what I see he writes] the only attempt to answer the question came from Whodey who said:

    [i]Christ was revolutionary in that he told his followers to t ...[text shortened]... not to be able to reply. If any Christian, or atheist [🙂], can answer it would be appreciated.
    God has always had a desire to interact with his people. It is clear in many places in the bible.
    God appeared to Abraham in human form to interact with him. Gen. 18:1
    In 1Sam 3:10, he called out to Samuel when he was a a child.
    In 1Kings 3:5 he appeared to Solomon in a dream.
    In 1Kings 11:9 God was angry with Solomon because his heart turned away from God after appearing to him twice.
    He spoke to Daniel, Steven in Acts, Paul in many ways through visions, revelation, etc.
    There are many, many examples. He showed Peter his vision for the Gentiles.
    How can any Christian not have a daily communion, heart sharing relationship with God and Jesus?
    God has warned me many times about doing or not doing various things. He puts ideas in my mind through his spirit that is in me.
    Even my grand daughter who was going to a certain place told me the Lord told her not to go there.
    If a person does not believe that God and Jesus speak and relate things to his people, He won't. It is vital for a Christian to have a real and vibrant relationship with Jesus Christ.
    Even Jesus said the following...
    Luke 12:12
    For the Holy Spirit will teach you in that very hour what you ought to say."
    NKJV

    How is that going to happen if you have no relationship with him?
    The most important thing about Christianity IS having a relationship with God and Jesus Christ. That is Christianity 101.
  10. Standard memberRajk999
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    22 Apr '17 23:03
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    God has always had a desire to interact with his people. It is clear in many places in the bible.
    God appeared to Abraham in human form to interact with him. Gen. 18:1
    In 1Sam 3:10, he called out to Samuel when he was a a child.
    In 1Kings 3:5 he appeared to Solomon in a dream.
    In 1Kings 11:9 God was angry with Solomon because his heart turned away fr ...[text shortened]... about Christianity IS having a relationship with God and Jesus Christ. That is Christianity 101.
    What you have just done is to describe a one way relationship, if there is such a thing. You have described a God which is controlling you, and telling you what to do. Of course God can do that. Nobody is arguing that point. But where is the relationship?

    You asked : How is that going to happen if you have no relationship with him?

    Here is the answer : There are many examples of God telling people what to do and making people to stuff TO CAUSE THEIR DOWNFALL. These people had no relationship with God. So God does these things with or without your so called relationship.

    Furthermore there are many who do wrong things and then claim that God told them to do this, that and the other. God is their scapegoat. I remember stories of several pastors who said that God was responsible for their sins. Is that the relationship you say is so important?

    You have not answered the question clearly and if it is the most important thing as you say, then you should be able to explain it as it is not explained in the Bible.
  11. SubscriberSuzianne
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    22 Apr '17 23:17
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    What you have just done is to describe a one way relationship, if there is such a thing. You have described a God which is controlling you, and telling you what to do. Of course God can do that. Nobody is arguing that point. But where is the relationship?

    You asked : How is that going to happen if you have no relationship with him?

    Here is the a ...[text shortened]... ant thing as you say, then you should be able to explain it as it is not explained in the Bible.
    And you wonder why no one answers you. This is all you have to offer, brainless naysaying.
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    22 Apr '17 23:29
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    What you have just done is to describe a one way relationship, if there is such a thing. You have described a God which is controlling you, and telling you what to do. Of course God can do that. Nobody is arguing that point. But where is the relationship?

    You asked : How is that going to happen if you have no relationship with him?

    Here is the a ...[text shortened]... ant thing as you say, then you should be able to explain it as it is not explained in the Bible.
    What you have just done is to describe a one way relationship, if there is such a thing. You have described a God which is controlling you, and telling you what to do. Of course God can do that. Nobody is arguing that point. But where is the relationship?

    It is a two way relationship. I can ask God for things and if it is good and brings him glory, I get it. I also talk to him constantly, sometimes praise, sometimes questions. I don't always get answers, but much of the time I do.
    God does NOT control people, Satan does. You get them mixed up sometimes.

    Here is the answer : There are many examples of God telling people what to do and making people to stuff TO CAUSE THEIR DOWNFALL. These people had no relationship with God. So God does these things with or without your so called relationship.
    Again, God does not control people, Satan does.

    Furthermore there are many who do wrong things and then claim that God told them to do this, that and the other. God is their scapegoat. I remember stories of several pastors who said that God was responsible for their sins. Is that the relationship you say is so important?

    God will NEVER ask you to do "the wrong thing". God is good. The pastors you mention were listening to someone else. God can ask but many people will not do what he says, I agree. Then there are consequences for not doing his will, but God is not to be blamed.

    You have not answered the question clearly and if it is the most important thing as you say, then you should be able to explain it as it is not explained in the Bible.

    I thought I was pretty clear. Ask God to help you understand.
  13. Standard memberKellyJay
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    23 Apr '17 00:242 edits
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    [b]What you have just done is to describe a one way relationship, if there is such a thing. You have described a God which is controlling you, and telling you what to do. Of course God can do that. Nobody is arguing that point. But where is the relationship?

    It is a two way relationship. I can ask God for things and if it is good and brings him gl ...[text shortened]... not explained in the Bible.[/b]

    I thought I was pretty clear. Ask God to help you understand.[/b]
    God used to walk with Adam and Eve before the fall, back when everything was very
    good. After the fall when the law was being established there was a veil that represented
    a divide between man and God, the holy and the most holy, which was ripped from top to
    bottom when Christ died.

    Matthew 27: 50-51 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

    Ephesians 2:13-18 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

    Access is now ours through Jesus, in this life, we are not waiting for the next life for this to
    begin. God has granted to us that the Holy Spirit would enter our lives and teach us about
    God, about Jesus, not in just the life time to come, but in this one! This is a one on one
    action it is not a global event, and it comes to those who belong to Christ.

    John 15: 26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

    John 16:13-15 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

    Galatians 3:14
    That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

    1 Corinthians 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

    Philippians 3:8
    Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

    2 Peter 1:2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

    Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

    Ephesians 3:16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;

    The thing is, God is the best part of Christianity in this life time, I find it odd that those that
    claim to belong to Him don't know about experiencing God in this life, what does that say
    about them?

    Luke 11: 9-13 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you. For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent? Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
  14. Standard memberRajk999
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    23 Apr '17 00:32
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    [b]What you have just done is to describe a one way relationship, if there is such a thing. You have described a God which is controlling you, and telling you what to do. Of course God can do that. Nobody is arguing that point. But where is the relationship?

    It is a two way relationship. I can ask God for things and if it is good and brings him gl ...[text shortened]... not explained in the Bible.[/b]

    I thought I was pretty clear. Ask God to help you understand.[/b]
    There are clear instances in the Bible where God controls people and they do BOTH good and evil things. So you are mistaken about that point. It is not always Satan as you claim.

    It is obvious that you are speaking from a church doctrine point of view and I am trying to find out what the Bibls says abnout this 'relationship with God' issue.

    From a Bible standpoint even though the word 'relationship' is not used, a professed Christians can have :
    - A Bad relationship with God
    - No relationship with God
    - A Good relationship with God.
  15. SubscriberFMF
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    23 Apr '17 00:36
    Originally posted by Suzianne to Rajk999
    And you wonder why no one answers you. This is all you have to offer, brainless naysaying.
    Oh the irony, especially you coming out with only this, just as both KellyJay and checkbaiter - unlike you - are making serious extended attempts to answer him and engage his question.
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