1. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    28 Jan '14 08:282 edits
    "Why I Am Not A Christian" by Bertrand Russell

    "Introductory note: Russell delivered this lecture on March 6, 1927 to the National Secular Society, South London Branch, at Battersea Town Hall. Published in pamphlet form in that same year, the essay subsequently achieved new fame with Paul Edwards' edition of Russell's book, Why I Am Not a Christian and Other Essays." 1957. Final Remarks:

    "What We Must Do" "We want to stand upon our own feet and look fair and square at the world -- its good facts, its bad facts, its beauties, and its ugliness; see the world as it is and be not afraid of it. Conquer the world by intelligence and not merely by being slavishly subdued by the terror that comes from it. *The whole conception of God is a conception derived from the ancient Oriental despotisms. It is a conception quite unworthy of free men.

    When you hear people in church debasing themselves and saying that they are miserable sinners, and all the rest of it, it seems contemptible and not worthy of self-respecting human beings. We ought to stand up and look the world frankly in the face. We ought to make the best we can of the world, and if it is not so good as we wish, after all it will still be better than what these others have made of it in all these ages.

    A good world needs knowledge, kindliness, and courage; it does not need a regretful hankering after the past or a fettering of the free intelligence by the words uttered long ago by ignorant men. It needs a fearless outlook and a free intelligence. *It needs hope for the future, not looking back all the time toward a past that is dead, which we trust will be far surpassed by the future that our intelligence can create." http://www.users.drew.edu/~jlenz/whynot.html


    Romans 1:22, “Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.”

    Proverbs 12:15, “The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkened unto counsel is wise.”

    Proverbs 14:16, “A wise man feareth, and departeth from evil: but the fool rageth, and is confident.”

    Proverbs 26:12, “Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? There is more hope of a fool than of him."


    *"It needs hope for the future, not looking back all the time toward a past that is dead, which we trust will be far surpassed by the future that our intelligence can create." Having rejected "the whole conception of God"... did Russell worship himself?
  2. Standard membercaissad4
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    28 Jan '14 08:44
    I read that book at age 14. It was in my family library.
  3. Cape Town
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    28 Jan '14 10:45
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    Romans 1:22, “Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.”

    Proverbs 12:15, “The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkened unto counsel is wise.”

    Proverbs 14:16, “A wise man feareth, and departeth from evil: but the fool rageth, and is confident.”

    Proverbs 26:12, “Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? There is more hope of a fool than of him."
    Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful.

    Lucius Annaeus Seneca
  4. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    28 Jan '14 11:41
    “I do not myself feel that any person who is really profoundly humane can believe in everlasting punishment.” -Bertrand Russell, Why I Am Not a Christian and Other Essays on Religion and Related Subjects

    “There is one very serious defect to my mind in Christ's moral character, and that is that He believed in hell. I do not myself feel that any person who is really profoundly humane can believe in everlasting punishment... There are other things of less importance. There is the instance of the Gadarene swine where it certainly was not very kind to the pigs to put devils into them and make them rush down the hill to the sea. You must remember that He was omnipotent, and He could have made the devils simply go away; but he chooses to send them into the pigs.

    Then there is the curious story of the fig-tree, which always rather puzzled me. You remember what happened about the fig-tree. 'He was hungry; and seeing a fig-tree afar off having leaves, He came if haply He might find anything thereon; and when He came to it He found nothing but leaves, for the time for figs was not yet. And Jesus answered and said unto it: "No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever,"...and Peter... saith unto Him: "Master, behold the fig-tree which thou cursedst is withered away".' This is a very curious story, because it was not the right time of year for figs, and you really could not blame the tree. I cannot myself feel that either in matter of wisdom or in matter of virtue Christ stands quite as high as some other people known to history. I think I should put Buddha and Socrates above Him in those respects.” -Bertrand Russell, Why I Am Not a Christian and Other Essays on Religion and Related Subjects

    “I believe that when I die I shall rot, and nothing of my ego will survive.”
    -Bertrand Russell, Why I Am Not a Christian and Other Essays on Religion and Related Subjects

    http://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/1043242-why-i-am-not-a-christian-and-other-essays-on-religion-and-related-subjec
  5. Standard membersonship
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    28 Jan '14 13:333 edits
    One Christian philosopher's response.

    J.P. Moreland Phd. "Why I'm Not an Atheist"
    Talk starts at about 1:06 on the video.

    YouTube
  6. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    28 Jan '14 16:12
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful.

    Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    "Harm: All cruelty springs from weakness." Lucius Annaeus Seneca

    "Anger: an acid that can do more harm to the vessel in which it is stored than to anything on which it is poured." -Lucius Annaeus Seneca

    "If one does not know to which port one is sailing, no wind is favorable." Lucius Annaeus Seneca

    "Business, Wind, Sailing: The day which we fear as our last is but the birthday of eternity." Lucius Annaeus Seneca

    "I don't consider myself bald, I'm just taller than my hair." Lucius Annaeus Seneca


    Harm, Anger, Uncertainty, Eternity, Aging [mortality with humour]: Interesting religious thinker.
  7. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    28 Jan '14 16:241 edit
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]
    Romans 1:22, “Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.”

    Proverbs 12:15, “The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkened unto counsel is wise.”

    Proverbs 14:16, “A wise man feareth, and departeth from evil: but the fool rageth, and is confident.”

    Proverbs 26:12, “Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? There is more hope of a fool than of him."
    I love it when these very general verses are applied to a specific issue. They do nothing at all to establish Russell's position as wise or foolish; they just invoke the authority of the Bible to condemn something that (in the poster's opinion, and no one else's!) is foolish.

    They can be used in any situation, really.

    Q: "What do you think of Congress' plan to increase the debt ceiling?"
    A: "Well, like the Bible says, 'professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.'

    Such a cheap tactic.
  8. Territories Unknown
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    28 Jan '14 17:021 edit
    Originally posted by SwissGambit
    I love it when these very [b]general verses are applied to a specific issue. They do nothing at all to establish Russell's position as wise or foolish; they just invoke the authority of the Bible to condemn something that (in the poster's opinion, and no one else's!) is foolish.

    They can be used in any situation, really.

    Q: "What do you ...[text shortened]... e the Bible says, 'professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.'

    Such a cheap tactic.[/b]
    I love it when these very general verses are applied to a specific issue.
    No, you don't.
    Otherwise, you wouldn't employ sarcasm to make the point.

    Moreover, while the passages quoted are general in nature, they are specific in topic; namely, they address the situation of man's arrogance, specifically related to considering his own thinking as superior to God's.

    Here, the poster is considering Russell's claims of superior thinking.
    Russell quotes a few situations and topics which, to his elevated moral status as a free human being, pits his perspectives on the topics as elevated above God's.

    Russell spent considerable time on the topic of God and, with chess-like precision, endeavored to eliminate any need for God and thereby excuse Him from the room.

    Too often, we believe the press about ourselves, and Russell was certainly no exception.
    As brilliant as they come; sadly, he knew that and allowed it to guide his thinking not realizing where that isolation would lead him.

    Perhaps his dysfunctional upbringing stunted a more normal upbringing thereby condemning him to a life of despondency.
  9. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    28 Jan '14 19:461 edit
    Originally posted by FreakyKBH
    [b]I love it when these very general verses are applied to a specific issue.
    No, you don't.
    Otherwise, you wouldn't employ sarcasm to make the point.

    Moreover, while the passages quoted are general in nature, they are specific in topic; namely, they address the situation of man's arrogance, specifically related to considering his own thinki ...[text shortened]... nal upbringing stunted a more normal upbringing thereby condemning him to a life of despondency.[/b]
    Hey, look, it's GB's bodyguard. 😵
  10. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    28 Jan '14 19:52
    Originally posted by SwissGambit
    Hey, look, it's GB's bodyguard. 😵
    SG, most everyone other than old ladies and decrepit codgers in nursing
    homes will need an online 'bodyguard' or two at "DOGG's 2nd coming".
  11. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    28 Jan '14 19:55
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    SG, most everyone other than old ladies and decrepit codgers in nursing
    homes will need an online 'bodyguard' or two at "DOGG's 2nd coming".
    You better believe it. 😀
  12. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    28 Jan '14 20:00
    Originally posted by SwissGambit
    You better believe it. 😀
    Yep, believing it and in doing so 'Making RHP better', one DOGG 'at a time'.
  13. SubscriberSuzianne
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    28 Jan '14 20:42
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]"Why I Am Not A Christian" by Bertrand Russell

    [quote]"Introductory note: Russell delivered this lecture on March 6, 1927 to the National Secular Society, South London Branch, at Battersea Town Hall. Published in pamphlet form in that same year, the essay subsequently achieved new fame with Paul Edwards' edition of Russell's book, Why I Am Not ...[text shortened]... gence can create." Having rejected "the whole conception of God"... did Russell worship himself?[/b]
    I'm sorry.

    I can't really be bothered by most of what Bertrand Russell has to say.

    Ditto Richard Dawkins.

    Ditto Christopher Hitchens.
  14. Territories Unknown
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    28 Jan '14 20:56
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    I'm sorry.

    I can't really be bothered by most of what Bertrand Russell has to say.

    Ditto Richard Dawkins.

    Ditto Christopher Hitchens.
    For me, it is much like hearing a classically trained operatic voice used ever so slightly off-key.
  15. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    28 Jan '14 21:18
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    I'm sorry.

    I can't really be bothered by most of what Bertrand Russell has to say.

    Ditto Richard Dawkins.

    Ditto Christopher Hitchens.
    Suzi, your words surprise me. Russell and Dawkins and Hitchens among other famous atheists have directly influenced the thinking, decisions and arguments of the same atheist friends you [and I] engage in frequent thoughtful conversation here.
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