worthless good works (calling out rajk99)

Originally posted by epiphinehas
Reading scriptures with blinders on again are we?

Based on the demonstrable imbalance with which you habitually interpret scripture, it is not surprising that you refuse to grasp the concept of the "infants in Christ" who are yet "of the flesh" of which Paul speaks in 1 Corinthians 3. You display a marked tendency toward reactionary thought, so it ma standing of scripture, unless such a refusal were couched in the irrationality of emotion.

Are you speaking about me?

P.S. If so, who am I?

Originally posted by SwissGambit
If I'm homeless, I have nothing. It is meaningless to talk about my willingness to pay for ANYTHING - I simply can't do it. If it has any cost, it isn't helping me.

More than one slave started out that way.
Help with strings, isn't always help.
Kelly

Originally posted by epiphinehas
Reading scriptures with blinders on again are we?

Based on the demonstrable imbalance with which you habitually interpret scripture, it is not surprising that you refuse to grasp the concept of the "infants in Christ" who are yet "of the flesh" of which Paul speaks in 1 Corinthians 3. You display a marked tendency toward reactionary thought, so it ma standing of scripture, unless such a refusal were couched in the irrationality of emotion.

Forget the sin aspect of the individual. My focus as always is not the individual or judging of the individual who sins. We all sin. All of us are fleshly nature.

Focus on the teachings of Christ and Paul. How can you teach that once a believer is baptised or upon accepting Christ, then that believer cannot lose his salvation, despite subsequent grievous and maybe continuous sins. That is a license to sin.

The correct teaching is that we follow in the correct life and when Christ returns we will be rewarded. That is the correct teachings. Anything else leads individuals to fall away and sin.

Yes I agree that many new Christians are infants in Christ. Many need help and will change into adults in Christ and will follow through with a changed lifestyle. But the correct teaching of the church regarding sin must be adhered to. Sin is not something we escape from. Sin is not beneath us or past us. We cannot escape the consequences of sin even if we are baptised into Christ. Sin must be recognised for what it truly is. It is a pitfall that all Christians MUST be constantly aware of and not brushed aside.

I have seen remarks by Christians that once they are saved Christ has paid the price for their sins and they will not be judged for their sins. They are saved and no sins subsequent to their being saved can harm them. Sin therefore for them is no big deal.
That is wrong doctrine and contrary to Both Christ and Paul.

Originally posted by KellyJay
More than one slave started out that way.
Help with strings, isn't always help.
Kelly

OK, let's say I'm homeless and some rich guy helps me out of it, no strings attached. Why would I care what his motivation is?

Originally posted by KellyJay
I bet you would if his help cost you more than you were willing to pay.
Kelly

So the underlying assumption here is if a rich person helps you (a poor person) there is an ulterior motive. If a poor person helps a poor person that is higher on the moral totem pole, presumably.

Originally posted by sonhouse
That was 5 years ago. Anyway I didn't jump! I crawled up that dam truck🙂 What really got me was seeing about a dozen people standing around with their thumbs up their arse doing nothing, maybe hoping he would bleed?

I getcha. Most people don't know what to do in a crisis situation. They usually freeze up. Their excuse is legal problems resulting from their involvement.

Potentially you saved the guys life. I've never had the privilege of saving a life.

Of course, you could believe in Jesus as a result of our interaction, then I could claim a degree of credit for saving YOUR life. 😉 😀

Originally posted by sonhouse
So the underlying assumption here is if a rich person helps you (a poor person) there is an ulterior motive. If a poor person helps a poor person that is higher on the moral totem pole, presumably.

Nope not always, but getting help isn't always the best thing that can happen.
It is always better to be able to do for yourself.
If help is needed it should without a doubt be given.
Kelly

Originally posted by SwissGambit
OK, let's say I'm homeless and some rich guy helps me out of it, no strings attached. Why would I care what his motivation is?

I don't think you should care under those conditions if the guy/gal helping you
is either rich or poor.
Kelly

Originally posted by Rajk999
Forget the sin aspect of the individual. My focus as always is not the individual or judging of the individual who sins. We all sin. All of us are fleshly nature.

Focus on the teachings of Christ and Paul. How can you teach that once a believer is baptised or upon accepting Christ, then that believer cannot lose his salvation, despite subsequent grievous ...[text shortened]... therefore for them is no big deal.
That is wrong doctrine and contrary to Both Christ and Paul.

But Rajk , it is not the doctrine that is wrong , it is the interpretation of the doctrine.

The doctrine of being saved and sealed in the Spirit by faith and not losing salvation is sound because it is based on....

a) God's faithfulness
b) God's relentless compassion and love and yearning to redeem even the most stubborn of sinners
c) the work of the Holy Spirit

Where it goes wrong is with men interpreting it as "a license to sin" . The doctrine itself is not a "license to sin".

For example , the law of the right to self defence is not a licence to take vengence or murder but it could be seen as such.

By attacking the doctrine you are throwing out the baby with the bath water.

Originally posted by knightmeister
..a) God's faithfulness
b) God's relentless compassion and love and yearning to redeem even the most stubborn of sinners
c) the work of the Holy Spirit...

On the day of judgment, Christ will divide the world into sheep and goats.

Sheep - those who have a personal relationship with 'Christ' ie they see him and help him in distress. Christ will reward them with eternal life.

Goats get death, because they do not have a personal relationship with Christ [read Matt 25].

The serious Christian follows this..
Php 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, .. work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

The jokers sit on their laurels and boast of their alleged regeneration, their alleged holy spirit gifts, their alleged freedom from judgment.

Originally posted by Rajk999
On the day of judgment, Christ will divide the world into sheep and goats.

Sheep - those who have a personal relationship with 'Christ' ie they see him and help him in distress. Christ will reward them with eternal life.

Goats get death, because they do not have a personal relationship with Christ [read Matt 25].

The serious Christian follows this ...[text shortened]... ir alleged regeneration, their alleged holy spirit gifts, their alleged freedom from judgment.

No one has said we will be sitting on our laurels with our gifts. The only thing
I have been saying is we are saved by God's grace through Jesus Christ! We
cannot earn God's free gift of salvation, to say you need to earn God's gift
is to turn God's gift into a wage for job well done, which like saying God must
give us His grace for the works we have done.

As we walk with God in this life we will be doing those things He desires which
is why we call him Lord.
Kelly

Originally posted by Rajk999
On the day of judgment, Christ will divide the world into sheep and goats.

Sheep - those who have a personal relationship with 'Christ' ie they see him and help him in distress. Christ will reward them with eternal life.

Goats get death, because they do not have a personal relationship with Christ [read Matt 25].

The serious Christian follows this ...[text shortened]... ir alleged regeneration, their alleged holy spirit gifts, their alleged freedom from judgment.

Ironically Php 2.12 goes on to talk about "it is God who works in you" - do you know what this means? What does God working IN YOU imply? Having God in you is a pretty darn amazing statement don't you think?

Of course , it fits very neatly with the work of the Holy Spirit. I don't know why you denigrate the Holy Spirit nor why you don't value the gifts of the Spirit. It would make sense if the action of the Holy Spirit was an idea first mooted by St Paul. But we both know that it was Jesus who talked explicitly about the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

It's incredible that you don't respect what Jesus has to say about the Spirit. Why should the Holy Spirit not transform or gift people? Who are you to downplay the work of the Living God?



".........to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, 13 for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose." Php 2.12

So many good works. Like a mini-golf scorecard.

Originally posted by knightmeister
Ironically Php 2.12 goes on to talk about "it is God who works in you" - do you know what this means? What does God working IN YOU imply? Having God in you is a pretty darn amazing statement don't you think?

Of course , it fits very neatly with the work of the Holy Spirit. I don't know why you denigrate the Holy Spirit nor why you don't value the g ...[text shortened]... God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose." Php 2.12

Christ knows who is saved. Not you.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Christ knows who is saved. Not you.

Are you suggesting you know who is saved and KM doesn't know, because
if you are, you are really full of yourself. If you are just saying only Christ
knows who is saved why are you trying to tell everyone according to the way
you read scripture who is and isn't saved as if you do know?
Kelly