You were dead in your sins, a very difficult place to be to then justify yourself, to make one's self righteous enough to be acceptable to God. But God rich in mercy because of His great love made us alive together with Christ. This was done by grace not as a result of works, so it is God working and we are His workmanship. The thing about all of this is God's love for us, the whole point of God sending Jesus to us was His love for us.
Ephesians 2 English Standard Version (ESV)
And you were dead in the trespasses and sins in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
@kellyjay saidNo.
@SecondSon
Well said. 🙂
Not so easy.
Why were you 'dead'?
Did you give up all hope, simply because you had flaws?
@secondson saidThe thing about Christ liveth in me shows a connection between man and God; this is real-time today, not in the by and by. The reason this is so important is that we right now live in a fallen world, disconnected from the source of all life God. We live in dying bodies that are decaying and will end; also, we live in a fallen world where all manner of evil is going on, human on human hate and crimes all of this as a result of human wickedness and evil. God out of His love for us, and because of His love for us offers to man as a gift of salvation in Jesus Christ, this is so great it can not be earned, just accepted due to the high cost, the life of the Son of God so by God we are saved for God. We are so unworthy of it, but that God loves us, and it is His love for us, not our worth that brings this about.
Yes I was.
Galatians 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Attempting to put anything before the salvation of Jesus Christ is sin, suggesting Jesus Christ laying down His life was not enough.
@kellyjay saidI think if your religious beliefs have transformed you from feeling "you were dead" into feeling you can cope with life, I don't see how this can be of any harm to you. It's a whatever-floats-your-boats situation. If you felt "you were dead", then your boat obviously needed floating.
The thing about Christ liveth in me shows a connection between man and God; this is real-time today, not in the by and by. The reason this is so important is that we right now live in a fallen world, disconnected from the source of all life God. We live in dying bodies that are decaying and will end; also, we live in a fallen world where all manner of evil is going on, human ...[text shortened]... orthy of it, but that God loves us, and it is His love for us, not our worth that brings this about.
@kellyjay saidDo your beliefs regarding "Jesus Christ laying down His life" mean you perceive no obligation to obey His commandments and do good works? Do you believe you can gain "salvation" and "everlasting life" even if you do not obey His commandments and do not do good works?
Attempting to put anything before the salvation of Jesus Christ is sin, suggesting Jesus Christ laying down His life was not enough.
@bigdoggproblem saidThere was no hope being dead in sin. What the OT showed that we could not obey the laws, that people could not remain faithful. Even the best of us sinned and did horrible things, and in the end the whole race was going to stand before a Holy and Just God to given an account. We were powerless to alter our fate on our own.
No.
Not so easy.
Why were you 'dead'?
Did you give up all hope, simply because you had flaws?
@kellyjay saidI have a question which I will ask you even though you are a lilly-livered coward and won’t answer me. So I’ll open it also to anyone else...
You were dead in your sins, a very difficult place to be to then justify yourself, to make one's self righteous enough to be acceptable to God.
You say that you were “dead”. In a port further down you say that your body is dying. Ok so your body is still alive but dying.
Exactly what part of you is “dead”?
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
No.
Not so easy.
Why were you 'dead'?
Did you give up all hope, simply because you had flaws?
Man is a three part being - spirit and soul and body. From the inside out it is the spirit as the innermost God contacting organ, the soul as the outer vessel and the body as the outermost vessel.
The human spirit of every fallen descendant of Adam is deadened. The spirit is comatose and needs to be enlivened by God.
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
From another angle, from the top down, the human spirit was created as the highest part of man. Underneath it was the soul inbetween the spirit above and the lowest part the body.
The highest part, the spirit of all fallen people is comatose, deadened, damaged and in need to be enlivened by God.
So when the Bible says we were dead in our sins and trespasses it is speaking mainly of the deadened human spirit, the kernel of man - the nucleus of man, or the highest part of man designed for direct contact with God the Spirit.
This is a brief explanation, easy to find problems with. But it is concise and to the point. Part of our being before regeneration and being born of the Spirit, God's Spirit, is deaden.
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
I don't like to say completely dead because the human conscience is part of the damaged spirit. And as long as a man has a conscience I think that part of his spirit is functioning somewhat, it seems.
It is perhaps to think of dead there to mean separated. Man is "alienated from the life of God" (Eph. 4:18).
Dead in sins - alienated from God Himself in a separation from a connection with God in the innermost part - the human spirit.
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
I have a question which I will ask you even though you are a lilly-livered coward and won’t answer me. So I’ll open it also to anyone else...
You say that you were “dead”. In a port further down you say that your body is dying. Ok so your body is still alive but dying.
Exactly what part of you is “dead”?
The innermost part of fallen man comes into the world deadened. The spirit is "dead". The spirit is separated from God.
"That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit" (John 3:6) .
The capital S means God the Spirit, God Himself.
The small s means the spirit of man.
It does not mean his soul, much less his body.
It means his innermost being - the human spirit.
It is the innermost nucleus of the metaphysical being, the spirit, that needs to be made alive.
"Let the dead bury their own dead" means the physically living are dead in their spirit until the miracle of being born of God. They bury their own physically dead.