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  1. 19 Oct '09 03:38
    I have just recently read and watched The Damned United. Both are excellent but also very depressing from a Scottish point of view. I can remember the eras of the 60s, 70s and 80s where the best teams in the English 1st division had a lot of Scottish players in them. The great Leeds Utd team were half Scottish (Harvey, McQueen, Bremner, Lorimer, Jordan, the Grays). The backbone of the Liverpool and Notts Forest sides that won the European Cup were Scottish also. Most of the English 1st division teams had at least one good Scottish player. Bearing in mind that Scottish domestic and national teams were also doing very well in this same period, I have a few questions.
    Why are current Scottish players so abismal?
    Is there anything that can be done to remedy this?
    Would the proposed Atlantic league be good or bad for Scottish football?
  2. 19 Oct '09 21:37
    youth setup.
  3. 20 Oct '09 12:00
    Originally posted by The Snapper
    I have just recently read and watched The Damned United. Both are excellent but also very depressing from a Scottish point of view. I can remember the eras of the 60s, 70s and 80s where the best teams in the English 1st division had a lot of Scottish players in them. The great Leeds Utd team were half Scottish (Harvey, McQueen, Bremner, Lorimer, Jordan, ...[text shortened]... e done to remedy this?
    Would the proposed Atlantic league be good or bad for Scottish football?
    When national footie reaches such an abysmal state do Scots root for England in Wolrdcup play or do they pull a Murray and show up wearing opponent teeshirts?
  4. 20 Oct '09 12:18
    Originally posted by scacchipazzo
    When national footie reaches such an abysmal state do Scots root for England in Wolrdcup play or do they pull a Murray and show up wearing opponent teeshirts?
    lol what do you think?
  5. 20 Oct '09 12:32 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by scacchipazzo
    When national footie reaches such an abysmal state do Scots root for England in Wolrdcup play or do they pull a Murray and show up wearing opponent teeshirts?
    yup you got it in one!

    actually it depends, scacchipazzo, for there are historical, cultural and even religious elements at play here.

    For example there are two major teams in Glasgow, Glasgow Rangers, and Glasgow Celtic. The former is associated with protestantism and the orange movement, the second with Catholicism and in times past, the struggle for Irish independence, and the I.R.A. This i think is totally unique and not very much understood by those who know nothing of the history. Thus it is not unusual to see, in Scotland, supporters of Glasgow Rangers wearing the English national team strip. why is this the case? because Protestantism and support for the British monarchy has its basis in a long history, dating back hundreds of years, when the Kingship was contested, between the protestant King, William of Orange, and the Catholic King, Charles the II.

    Many battles were fought, which some insist on celebrating today, thus, what we have is a religious geopolitical type of polarity, either for protestantism, the British government, the separation of Northern Ireland as a British province, or support for Catholicism and the establishment of a united Ireland.

    You will note that strangely enough, the affairs of Ireland have spilled over across the water. thus as far as football is concerned, although i do not know if it is still permitted, you shall see British Union flags in the Rangers end, and Irish flags in the Celtic end.

    True followers of the Scottish national team, termed the tartan army, have nothing to do with this sectarianism, and just want to have a good time, sing songs, drink beer and cheer everyone up! You could take your family to a Scotland match, but under no circumstances could you attend a Celtic and Rangers match, people are killed every year!

    Scottish football is mince cause we got no dosh, even the measly teams in the English premiership are guaranteed millions every year through sponsorship deals.
  6. 20 Oct '09 13:44
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    yup you got it in one!

    actually it depends, scacchipazzo, for there are historical, cultural and even religious elements at play here.

    For example there are two major teams in Glasgow, Glasgow Rangers, and Glasgow Celtic. The former is associated with protestantism and the orange movement, the second with Catholicism and in times past, the ...[text shortened]... y teams in the English premiership are guaranteed millions every year through sponsorship deals.
    hello sports forum, hello

    i've always been interested if it's the irish contingent flying the flags during the old firm matches or do scottish people join in as well?
  7. 20 Oct '09 14:06
    Originally posted by trev33
    hello sports forum, hello

    i've always been interested if it's the irish contingent flying the flags during the old firm matches or do scottish people join in as well?
    trev trev me ol son, relax, i was just underpinning the various elements as to why it might be conceivable to see young Scotsmen dawning the English national kit.

    you must understand that the Scots of the west, and the Irish are essentially the same people. My grandfather was Irish as were almost about 70 percent of the peoples where i live, potato famine and all that.

    anyhow to your question, what happens is that there is an Irish contingent that buses it over from Ireland so they bring theirs, and then their is the Scottish contingent who bring theirs as well.

    one of the great things about the old firm, although i think the Euro nambies have banned it, under the guise of inciting to religious hatred, was the singing of sectarian songs. Thus Celtic fans would sing the soldiers song (national anthem of southern Ireland), and the Rangers fans had their own, like the Sash, an Irish ballad commemorating the victory of William of orange in Ireland in the 1600s.

    where i live, people drape either Union flags, or Irish tri colours from their windows, during important matches. i myself would much rather drape the royal family,
  8. 20 Oct '09 14:18
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    trev trev me ol son, relax, i was just underpinning the various elements as to why it might be conceivable to see young Scotsmen dawning the English national kit.

    you must understand that the Scots of the west, and the Irish are essentially the same people. My grandfather was Irish as were almost about 70 percent of the peoples where i live, pota ...[text shortened]... their windows, during important matches. i myself would much rather drape the royal family,
    i'm relaxed.. honest, it's just that i'm from n. ireland so all this is all to familiar. i had originally thought that it would be mostly irish people flying either flags but i guess when you walk around certain parts of belfast and see either palestinian or israeli flags i'm not surprised if the scottish have got in on the flags act.

    ever had the conversation with an Englishman trying to tell you that any english soccer rivalry is as strong as the old firm? gets me in stitches every time.
  9. 20 Oct '09 14:24
    Originally posted by The Snapper
    I have just recently read and watched The Damned United. Both are excellent but also very depressing from a Scottish point of view. I can remember the eras of the 60s, 70s and 80s where the best teams in the English 1st division had a lot of Scottish players in them. The great Leeds Utd team were half Scottish (Harvey, McQueen, Bremner, Lorimer, Jordan, ...[text shortened]... e done to remedy this?
    Would the proposed Atlantic league be good or bad for Scottish football?
    I had no idea Scotland had a football team. Do they all were kilts?

    Edit: Just don't tell Rush Limbaugh, he might want to buy you up!!
  10. 20 Oct '09 15:06
    Originally posted by trev33
    i'm relaxed.. honest, it's just that i'm from n. ireland so all this is all to familiar. i had originally thought that it would be mostly irish people flying either flags but i guess when you walk around certain parts of belfast and see either palestinian or israeli flags i'm not surprised if the scottish have got in on the flags act.

    ever had the convers ...[text shortened]... hat any english soccer rivalry is as strong as the old firm? gets me in stitches every time.
    sorry Trev, i dont need to tell you then my friend how it is, i didn't realise, i thought you was from Anglesey
  11. 20 Oct '09 15:09
    Originally posted by whodey
    I had no idea Scotland had a football team. Do they all were kilts?

    Edit: Just don't tell Rush Limbaugh, he might want to buy you up!!
    we have a rugby team that wear kilts, dig this Whodey my good man.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaJSGky4F4U
  12. 21 Oct '09 02:48 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    yup you got it in one!

    actually it depends, scacchipazzo, for there are historical, cultural and even religious elements at play here.

    For example there are two major teams in Glasgow, Glasgow Rangers, and Glasgow Celtic. The former is associated with protestantism and the orange movement, the second with Catholicism and in times past, the ...[text shortened]... y teams in the English premiership are guaranteed millions every year through sponsorship deals.
    Hogwash! Just an excuse to drink more beer to drown away Scottish sorrows! But that's local politics. I'm talking about worldcup play. If England advances do you support the team of the Rose or do you egg on Paraguay or any other opponent? Complicated history, ya'lls'. I know many a proud Scot, but I would think they're Scots first, Brits second. With no dog in the fight do you pull for England? BTW, I love everything and anything Scottish, even Haggas, although I put plenty of Tabasco on it to kill the smell of sheep gonads!
  13. Standard member Mctayto
    Highlander
    21 Oct '09 09:27
    Originally posted by scacchipazzo
    Hogwash! Just an excuse to drink more beer to drown away Scottish sorrows! But that's local politics. I'm talking about worldcup play. If England advances do you support the team of the Rose or do you egg on Paraguay or any other opponent? Complicated history, ya'lls'. I know many a proud Scot, but I would think they're Scots first, Brits second. With n ...[text shortened]... ish, even Haggas, although I put plenty of Tabasco on it to kill the smell of sheep gonads!
    NEVER, NEVER, NEVER would a Scotsman with an ounce of breath cheer for anything other than englands head on a platter.
  14. 21 Oct '09 09:39
    Originally posted by Mctayto
    [b]NEVER, NEVER, NEVER would a Scotsman with an ounce of breath cheer for anything other than englands head on a platter.[/b]
    don't tell me you didn't get caught up in it all during euro 96 and want them to win a little bit... just a little bit
  15. 21 Oct '09 11:32
    Originally posted by Mctayto
    [b]NEVER, NEVER, NEVER would a Scotsman with an ounce of breath cheer for anything other than englands head on a platter.[/b]
    An honest answer at last! Just as I thought. The Murray thing was not just tongue in cheek at all. Hence the comment in another thread about Argentina gonna kick English butt! Same feelings about Ireland or just merry old England?