@AverageJoe1
Where's no1 when you need him, eh?

Think Locke, who said we have natural rights (life, liberty, property), we establish government to protect these rights, the establishment of said government implies a social contract exists whereby we are obligated to respect other's rights if we expect our own rights to be respected.

Or that's what I think Spruce is getting at anyway.

@kevcvs57 said
No you telling them that the system is equitable and if they fail they’ve only themselves to blame is the mind poison.
I realise telling kids the truth is an anathema to right ing types sine the MAGA crowd took over the GOP but there is no excuse for lying

"Equitable" isn't a word I use. That's part of the leftist mind poison you have succumbed to. It is neither possible nor even desirable to devise a system for human beings that is equitable in the sense that you mean, and is downright abusive to give kids the notion that life should be that way. The best we can shoot for is equality under the law and freedom to pursue happiness in whatever way we choose. Yes there is social contract, and yes we do have obligations to one another, the contours of which can be debated. But society will not and should never be "equitable" because that could only be attempted through tyranny, and it would fail even then. This is known. Your educators have made you ignorant.

@kevcvs57 said
No bitterness at all just bemusement that most right wing yanks still cling to McCarthyism like an old well worn pillow they can cry into when reality smacks them in the face.
Preparing children for the real world is part and parcel of being an educator, rich folks send their children to schools that will give them a sense of superiority along with facts and figures.
Why ...[text shortened]... re rather than instilling them with self loathing for failing to attain the American Dream / Fantasy

Well, because it is mind poison?

A sense of self worth should be instilled by parents, not some "educator" teaching kids to hate society. Do you have a job? Maybe you are an entrepreneur? Do you take pride in the work you do for a living?

@suzianne said
It's quite simple.

Your talk and your walk do not have the same goals.

Yes everything is simple for you SuziQ because you are so very very smart.

What do you know of my walk?

@sonhouse said
@Sleepyguy
One question: How much does the concept of empathy come into any conservative debate? Isn't conservative debate more about not spending money and getting rid of government regulations? I don't see much arguments from conservatives about actually say lowering the price of meds or helping students get lower cost educations and the like, instead they seem to concentrate on having more cops or make more laws to make more folks breaking laws.

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to answer this. The concept of empathy comes into conservative debate roughly 32% ? It seems rather that you are making a statement that because conservatives want a smaller, less wasteful government, they must lack empathy. That is not a useful place to start. If we just allow ourselves to start arguing from that point on, we talk right past each other forever.

So instead of starting there, let's try to realize for a moment that all the various folks on this forum have a lot in common. We are all just people, after all, sharing our one lonely planet. We were all born and will die here. We all have some kind of family, parents at least, siblings perhaps, friends, people we love etc. We all need shelter, food, warmth, safety, care, happiness and meaning in our lives. Being human beings, it is only natural that we all have empathy for others, even SuziQ does (for the worthy). So we should all be able to do each other the courtesy of assuming that even though we might disagree on how best to achieve it, we all would like a society that will result in shelter, food, safety, warmth, care, happiness and meaningful lives for the greatest number of citizens possible (without regard to race, gender etc, obviously). If you could start from there a meaningful discussion might be possible, and you might find the people you are so angry at have the same goals you do.

@kevcvs57 said
Hahaha a perfect example of how someone can be scooped up by a vortex of utter BS
Yeah them Marxists are everywhere, no one corrupts young minds like religion and right wing propaganda
For Marists educators read educators who teach reality as opposed to teaching them that every personal failure is their fault and they live in a perfect system.
No cyclical deprivation, no ...[text shortened]... ng the government and media outlets
If it wasn’t for them Marxist educators life would be peachy 🙄

There's the bitterness coming through. You learned a lot of terminology to explain that life is hard because you're an oppressed victim. Did you learn how to do anything?

@mchill said
Is anyone listening to this?

Are you listening to yourselves? Only liberals have a wider view of the world than just themselves while everyone else are just self centered navel-gazers with lower value as human beings.

You paid money for this education?

@suzianne said
A conservative would say that. For rather obvious reasons.

OMG, you are just so superior. So laughable. Well as a human being I value you SuziQ, even though you're a dolt and we disagree on everything. Our shared humanity binds us together whether you like it or not.

@suzianne said
Being admired by the right doesn't say much for one's value as a human being.

Political opinions shouldn't say anything at all about a person's value as a human being ... smh

@sonhouse said
@Sleepyguy
https://goodmenproject.com/featured-content/republicans-are-the-anti-education-party-and-proud-of-it/

https://www.quora.com/Why-does-getting-an-education-tend-to-turn-people-into-conservatives?top_ans=1477743698990190

There seems to be a plethora of articles like this.

Trump doesn't like educated folks it seems to me, like he says 'media is the enemy of ...[text shortened]... re many ways to do that and it is not up to me to say the morality of it is bad or good, it just is.

I think what some are identifying as disdain for education is actually disdain for left wing "educators" who take perfectly good young people and try turning them into bitter Marxists with gender dysphoria instead of successful happy people. Conservatives do value knowledge and skill, but modern universities have increasingly become an unsafe place to send your kids to get them. There are also plenty of intellectuals who are admired on the right, Jordan Peterson, Thomas Sowell, Milton Friedman and son on, but I'll bet they don't count for some reason.

@kevcvs57 said
it’s a very simple and well known fact and should probably be too obvious to debate.

Oh well then. You win! LOL.

@spruce112358 said
I do not know. "Hey Siri. Why does mcchill think that people....?"

Siri said he's just a hater.

@spruce112358 said
Education is essentially access to information, and the cost of education has plummeted as fast as the cost of computing power and information storage. The dams that held back information have burst. The people that tried to control the flow of information and charge for access have been swept away.

I think back to when I was young, paging through my grandfather's Enc ...[text shortened]... g for information for millenia, and now we have LIMITLESS ALL-YOU-CAN EAT BUFFETS 24/7.

Nom, nom.

Yep, it's great. Two thumbs up for easy access to information. So why does mchill think people on the right are against it?

@mchill said
- that are FREE.

The right wing's war on higher education in America is failing because of this.

You are saying the right wing doesn't want people to learn useful skills?

@wildgrass said
Joe, stop the nonsense please.

Suzianne and spruce answered your question right after you asked on page 2. Moonbus, sonhouse and yeah boy (and spruce again) answered page 3.

Overall you had 5 different posters answering your questions and you still ask the same dumb question over and over pretending no one did?

Ask another question or stop spamming this thread. We' ...[text shortened]... rying to figure out how it makes sense in MAGA land to make things illegal that are already illegal.

I think it is the enforcing part Joe might be concerned about.

I mean illegal immigration is illegal, right? Well problem solved then!