Manning posted a classified video of a helicopter attack showing what he considered a war crime, he followed his conscience, OK, I get it, well and good, he did what he thought was right, lot of people call him a hero for doing it.
Then he went on to put 700,000 classified documents of all sorts on the internet. He certainly couldn't have read 3/4 of a million documents, he didn't know or care what was in them, he just did it to be a jerk. For that reason he should get a whole lot of years in prison.
Originally posted by KilgoreTrout15Oke doke, I heard on a reliable radio programme that another 4 million people were already privvy to everything manning released and none of it was top secret because of his own clearance level.
Manning posted a classified video of a helicopter attack showing what he considered a war crime, he followed his conscience, OK, I get it, well and good, he did what he thought was right, lot of people call him a hero for doing it.
Then he went on to put 700,000 classified documents of all sorts on the internet. He certainly couldn't have read 3/4 of ...[text shortened]... em, he just did it to be a jerk. For that reason he should get a whole lot of years in prison.
Could you define a 'whole lot of years', just so I know what to expect as a fully paid member of the 'jerk' club.
1 edit
Originally posted by kevcvs57Oh some radio show said that?
Oke doke, I heard on a reliable radio programme that another 4 million people were already privvy to everything manning released and none of it was top secret because of his own clearance level.
Could you define a 'whole lot of years', just so I know what to expect as a fully paid member of the 'jerk' club.
1. Manning had a Top Secret clearance. Radio show be damned.
2. I'd sure like to know how they came up with the figure of 4 million people.
3. None of that matters anyway. If you have a security clearance and take a low level, totally innocuous Confidential document off site and show it to some friends just for bragging rights, you'd be most likely get a court martial and kicked out of the military. 700,000 spread all over the world?
I'd think 20 to life sounds reasonable.
i hope he appeals to throw out the espionage charges against him
he pleaded guilty on charges that would amount to 20 years in prison
that is more than enough. the government is clearly making an example out of him so future soldiers, whistle blowers, and journalists think twice before embarrassing the state ever again. why do you think snowden fled?
this shouldn't even be debated. manning made his choice knowing that this would happen to him. what should be debated are the war crimes, and the criminals that got away with it. the only person that got a slap on the wrist is the man that tormented manning for several months for no good reason. 8000$ fine. whoop-dee-friggen-doo!
sure, the video he released showed two children getting killed, and two journalists trying to save a civilians life get killed via double tapping (and triple tapping), but who cares! they are brownies! George Carlin, where are you, buddy? Louis C.K. aint cutting it for me...
Originally posted by kevcvs57Another 4 million people who have security clearances and are still not supposed to access it without a need to know. That's only assuming that number is correct.
Oke doke, I heard on a reliable radio programme that another 4 million people were already privvy to everything manning released and none of it was top secret because of his own clearance level.
Could you define a 'whole lot of years', just so I know what to expect as a fully paid member of the 'jerk' club.
The data he published was classified and what he did was a crime. Even material classified as Secret can potentially do serious harm.
If somebody should be excused after indicriminately leaking 750,000 classified documents, then we might as well do away with background checks and classifications altogether.
Originally posted by KilgoreTrout15This. I'm also curious how they came up with that 4 million number.
Oh some radio show said that?
1. Manning had a Top Secret clearance. Radio show be damned.
2. I'd sure like to know how they came up with the figure of 4 million people.
3. None of that matters anyway. If you have a security clearance and take a low level, totally innocuous Confidential document off site and show it to some friends just for bragg ...[text shortened]... the military. 700,000 spread all over the world?
I'd think 20 to life sounds reasonable.
Originally posted by USArmyParatrooperIt was a lawyer who was being interviewed on BBC Radio Four's 'Today' programme, I shall endeavour to check it out (does it make a difference) , also is 136 yrs overkill?
This. I'm also curious how they came up with that 4 million number.
How bad does the atrocity being divulged by any given Whistleblower have to be before the atrocity can be considered a mitigating factor in the Whistleblower's defence?
Originally posted by KilgoreTrout15I absolutely agree with you. Manning could not possibly have known how damaging everything he released could have been, not only to the country, but to individuals who may have had compromising information leaked about them.
Oh some radio show said that?
1. Manning had a Top Secret clearance. Radio show be damned.
2. I'd sure like to know how they came up with the figure of 4 million people.
3. None of that matters anyway. If you have a security clearance and take a low level, totally innocuous Confidential document off site and show it to some friends just for bragg ...[text shortened]... the military. 700,000 spread all over the world?
I'd think 20 to life sounds reasonable.
People went nuts when Scooter Libby blew Valarie Plame's cover. That was one person and Plame's life was never put in danger. For all Manning knew, the Wikileaks releases could have outed undercover agents, among many other severe harms he could have caused.
Originally posted by empovsunWell you answered your own question without whistleblowers governments and their servants will feel much more emboldened about committing crimes against percieved enemies, both domestic and foreign. The point of the sentence is wether it is justified in itself or whether it is a deterrent to future whistleblowers.
i hope he appeals to throw out the espionage charges against him
he pleaded guilty on charges that would amount to 20 years in prison
that is more than enough. the government is clearly making an example out of him so future soldiers, whistle blowers, and journalists think twice before embarrassing the state ever again. why do you think snowden fled?
...[text shortened]... s! they are brownies! George Carlin, where are you, buddy? Louis C.K. aint cutting it for me...
Originally posted by sh76US foreign policy is damaging to the country and to individuals.
I absolutely agree with you. Manning could not possibly have known how damaging everything he released could have been, not only to the country, but to individuals who may have had compromising information leaked about them.
People went nuts when Scooter Libby blew Valarie Plame's cover. That was one person and Plame's life was never put in danger. For all M ...[text shortened]... leases could have outed undercover agents, among many other severe harms he could have caused.
Originally posted by kevcvs57Among all of the things that Manning leaked, two maybe three things are even controversial. Something merely being controversial is not a reason to leak classified information. We can debate those separately, but for the purpose of this discussion I will give you those and we'll just charge him the remaining 749,997 documents.
It was a lawyer who was being interviewed on BBC Radio Four's 'Today' programme, I shall endeavour to check it out (does it make a difference) , also is 136 yrs overkill?
How bad does the atrocity being divulged by any given Whistleblower have to be before the atrocity can be considered a mitigating factor in the Whistleblower's defence?
Originally posted by sh76Well if information that could result in physical harm to friendly forces was not designated as top secret then Manning was the last link in a chain of bad decisions, the guy would have known His own clearance level and it is a stretch to say that He could not have known the consequences to His fellow servicemen and women, everything Manning revealed was historical, nothing involved an ongoing operation, the only harm was the diplomatic embarrassment suffered by not very nice people in not very nice governments including the Whitehouse.
I absolutely agree with you. Manning could not possibly have known how damaging everything he released could have been, not only to the country, but to individuals who may have had compromising information leaked about them.
People went nuts when Scooter Libby blew Valarie Plame's cover. That was one person and Plame's life was never put in danger. For all M ...[text shortened]... leases could have outed undercover agents, among many other severe harms he could have caused.
Originally posted by USArmyParatrooperYep...no matter how you slice it, indiscriminately putting 3/4 of a million classified documents online without knowing what was in them or how bad they could be for national security was unforgivable.
Among all of the things that Manning leaked, two maybe three things are even controversial. Something merely being controversial is not a reason to leak classified information. We can debate those separately, but for the purpose of this discussion I will give you those and we'll just charge him the remaining 749,997 documents.
Especially since he didn't do it out of some sort of crisis of conscience like he did the attack helicopter video, he just did it to be a dick.
Originally posted by USArmyParatrooperNo one is disputing that Manning broke His obligation to the military machine He voluntarily became a part of, the question is 136 years too much for a man who claims He broke that obligation as a matter of conscience.
Among all of the things that Manning leaked, two maybe three things are even controversial. Something merely being controversial is not a reason to leak classified information. We can debate those separately, but for the purpose of this discussion I will give you those and we'll just charge him the remaining 749,997 documents.
I could be wrong but haven't there been whistleblower's surrounding the Govts actions concerning a dead diplomat in Lybia?