- Joined
- 18 Jan 07
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- 12477
@shavixmir saidNever mind that. What has anything Metal, Marauder, and you have to do with reality?
What, exactly, does this have to do with the subject?
@shallow-blue saidOnce neocons start tossing around the "G" word, it's almost a certainty that Western bombs and missiles are about to fly.
That would be the first time in your life.
Stop quibbling about the legalistic apologies for an attempted genocide.
But so far it's been at small, weak countries; this time they might manage to get us into a nuclear war.
@ullr saidOne of the problems is "the inviolability of borders" and "peoples' right of self-determination" are often at odds. NATO saw fit to favor the latter in Kosovo but the former regarding the Crimea. And there's little doubt that much of Eastern Ukraine would choose to detach from the rest of the country if the Ukraine's government is hellbent on becoming an outpost of Western economic and military hegemony.
For anyone that cares the agreement between NATO and Russia signed in 1997 by Boris Yeltsin is here:
https://www.nato.int/nrc-website/media/59451/1997_nato_russia_founding_act.pdf
There are so many pertinent items in this agreement and this one among others stands out:
"respect for sovereignty, independence and territorial integrity of all states and
their inherent rig ...[text shortened]... other OSCE documents;"
If anyone violated an agreement or broke a promise, clearly it is Russia.
So it's quite a quandary.
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@no1marauder saidIt’s a shame none of that is true though. Russia invaded Crimea that’s a fact and it’s also a fact that Russian speaking Ukrainians in the east if Ukraine that has not been occupied by Russia since 2014 is putting up just as strong a defence against the Russian invaders as anywhere else in Ukraine. This is one of the facts on the ground that has upended Putins fantasy of a two or three day flower strewn parade through Ukraine culminating in taking Ukraine. Putin fans should at least try to keep abreast of reality.
One of the problems is "the inviolability of borders" and "peoples' right of self-determination" are often at odds. NATO saw fit to favor the latter in Kosovo but the former regarding the Crimea. And there's little doubt that much of Eastern Ukraine would choose to detach from the rest of the country if the Ukraine's government is hellbent on becoming an outpost of Western economic and military hegemony.
So it's quite a quandary.
If the US / NATO wanted to fight Russia they would cede to Ukraine’s plea for a no fly zone.
@kevcvs57 saidYour dream world has very little to do with reality. https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2015/03/20/one-year-after-russia-annexed-crimea-locals-prefer-moscow-to-kiev/?sh=1cb3a614510d
It’s a shame none of that is true though. Russia invaded Crimea that’s a fact and it’s also a fact that Russian speaking Ukrainians in the east if Ukraine that has not been occupied by Russia since 2014 is putting up just as strong a defence against the Russian invaders as anywhere else in Ukraine. This is one of the facts on the ground that has upended Putins fantasy of a t ...[text shortened]... ality.
If the US / NATO wanted to fight Russia they would cede to Ukraine’s plea for a no fly zone.
The pro-Russian, Opposition Platform - For Life performed strongly in eastern Ukraine in the 2019 elections. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Ukrainian_parliamentary_election#/media/[WORD TOO LONG].svg
The chairman of that party was arrested last May and charged with treason though he hasn't been tried. Three TV channels he ran were also shut down in "democratic" Ukraine. https://www.euronews.com/2021/05/13/ukraine-opposition-leader-and-putin-ally-under-house-arrest-after-being-charged-with-treas