Group Defends Carbon Dioxide as ‘Elixir of Life’ in Climate Change Debate

Originally posted by twhitehead
Why do you assume that everyone who disagrees with you must be 'the left'?

The fact is that large amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere are causing warming which causes change. Humans do not adapt well to change. Change is very very expensive.
Do you understand that much at least?

Considering there are people living in every extreme that currently exists on the planet, hot, cold, dry, wet shows humans adapt better than any known species.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Considering there are people living in every extreme that currently exists on the planet, hot, cold, dry, wet shows humans adapt better than any known species.

Humans have never reclaimed land from the Ocean. Never I tell you.

Ignore those guys who have the windmills, ignore them I tell you.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Considering there are people living in every extreme that currently exists on the planet, hot, cold, dry, wet shows humans adapt better than any known species.

Yeah... but there are a few basic requirements needed to be able to adjust...

Breathable air, bio-diversity, land, that sort of thing.

And what you don't want is to tip the balance so far over it can't be rectified by humans.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Considering there are people living in every extreme that currently exists on the planet, hot, cold, dry, wet shows humans adapt better than any known species.

Except cockroaches. But many 'known species' have gone extinct. Now I am not suggesting humans will go extinct, far from it. But there is not doubt whatsoever that humans do not handle change very well - and humans 'adapting' often involves conflict and lots of people dying.

But ultimately the question is not 'can we adapt?' the question is 'is it better to adapt or to do something about it instead?' Which is easier, which is cheaper? The real problem is humans are also terrible at long term planning and terrible at accessing gradual long term threats. Many people are quite happy passing the problem on to their children even if doing so will cost far far more (for their children).

Another problem is capitalism and the entrenched fossil fuels industry.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Considering there are people living in every extreme that currently exists on the planet, hot, cold, dry, wet shows humans adapt better than any known species.

Certainly and it is time for humans to adapt to climate change by curtailing the use of fossil fuels.

Instead of this, the present plan seems to be that wealthy Americans can burn the stuff and leave the third world to pay the price. The idea seems to be that the USA will somehow be spared the worst impacts but if not, hell, it will still be the poor that pay the highest price.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Why do you assume that everyone who disagrees with you must be 'the left'?

The fact is that large amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere are causing warming which causes change. Humans do not adapt well to change. Change is very very expensive.
Do you understand that much at least?

This kind of BS will come to a screeching halt when they find the seas are rising and tundra is disappearing and Florida is a thing of the past. Of course that won't be for 20 of 30 years but there will come a point when the most frothing at the mouth climate denier will be eating their words.

Originally posted by sonhouse
This kind of BS will come to a screeching halt when they find the seas are rising and tundra is disappearing and Florida is a thing of the past. Of course that won't be for 20 of 30 years but there will come a point when the most frothing at the mouth climate denier will be eating their words.

No, it won't. Where I work, there's a conservative who blames global warming on the sun.

It won't end, no matter how bad the world gets.

Originally posted by sonhouse
This kind of BS will come to a screeching halt when they find the seas are rising and tundra is disappearing and Florida is a thing of the past. Of course that won't be for 20 of 30 years but there will come a point when the most frothing at the mouth climate denier will be eating their words.

I remember hearing this in the early 80"s. We were all supposed to be dead about 15 years ago.
These are the stupid kinds of predictions that hurt your cause.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
I remember hearing this in the early 80"s. We were all supposed to be dead about 15 years ago.
These are the stupid kinds of predictions that hurt your cause.

Then there was the one about smoking causing cancer.

Just statistics.

Oh how we laughed.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
I remember hearing this in the early 80"s. We were all supposed to be dead about 15 years ago.
These are the stupid kinds of predictions that hurt your cause.

The thing is, global warming isn't politics and it isn't his 'cause' it is a fact. A fact that you are deliberately ignoring. The question is why? Is it because you think it is a leftist conspiracy?
The majority of people I have questioned in the past about it eventually admitted they believed there was a cost to admitting it (usually carbon taxes).

Originally posted by sh76
Yes, I agree that's a silly position to take.

Still, an analysis of both the positive and negative effects of global warming is not such a terrible thing. Maybe for every square kilometer made uninhabitable by flooding, two are made habitable by warming in the Arctic regions. Maybe increased vegetation takes CO2 out of the air, thereby causing a negative fee ...[text shortened]... e to hear from someone in the media without an axe to grind on these issues every now and again.

uhuh, and may i ask who gets this newly "inhabitable land"? will it be a "first come, first served"? will the russians and canadians be cool with millions of displaced chinese settling at the north pole?

do you also believe it will be a sudden trade? 1 square kilometer gets flooded on Monday and 2 sq km of Artica gets prime real estate on wednesday? or will millions of refugees have to deal for years until the land of their dreams opens up?

also, have you tried growing food in arctica? i am sure that 2 for 1 deal will be awesome when you lose imense areas of fertile indian and chinese farmland.


you have really thought this through. years of scientific experience are showing.

"I don't know."
usually a hint it's time to start knowing or keep one's mouth shut.

"It would be nice to hear from someone in the media without an axe to grind on these issues every now and again."
ah yes, the conspiracy. all those wind and solar energy tycoons wanting to make a killing. all those scientists living paycheck to paycheck because they didn't become whores.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Except cockroaches. But many 'known species' have gone extinct. Now I am not suggesting humans will go extinct, far from it. But there is not doubt whatsoever that humans do not handle change very well - and humans 'adapting' often involves conflict and lots of people dying.

But ultimately the question is not 'can we adapt?' the question is 'is it bett ...[text shortened]... (for their children).

Another problem is capitalism and the entrenched fossil fuels industry.

Yeah I saw something about cockroaches surviving with no head on the Simpsons too. The question is not '...not "can we adapt?". I am referring to the statement, of yours, i.e.:

"Humans do not adapt well to change."

Take a cockroach from a Philippine sewer and release it in a Koyuk Alaskan winter and see how long it lasts. but on the other hand I don't doubt for a minute that their are Filipinos living and working in all sorts of conditions all over the world including one or two in Koyuk. And I'm not comparing Filipinos to cockroaches you sick basterd. Mabait. I am stating that your comparing humans to cockroaches in respect to resilience and adaptibllty is ridiculous and no comparison at all, but it is typical of the misanthropic left.

Man shapes his environment to his needs and it is thankfully to fossil fuels that you live as you do and billions of others do too. Take a look around you twhitehead, everything has been shaped, transported, produced from, made possible by fossil fuels. Try to live one day without them, you'll probably make it through one day although the water and the pipes it travels down and the energy used to pump it is hard to do with out. Did the people that produced those goods and services do so for the good of twhitehead?

Originally posted by Wajoma
Yeah I saw something about cockroaches surviving with no head on the Simpsons too. The question is not '...not "can we adapt?". I am referring to the statement, of yours, i.e.:

"Humans do not adapt well to change."

Take a cockroach from a Philippine sewer and release it in a Koyuk Alaskan winter and see how long it lasts. but on the other hand I don ...[text shortened]... ith out. Did the people that produced those goods and services do so for the good of twhitehead?

Nobody advocates living without energy. There are alternative energy sources to fossil fuels however. Usng fossil fuels is irresponsible when there are alternatives.

The thing is not the availability of alternatives, it is the extent to which a very very wealthy mnority profit from their investment in fossil fuels. If we use alternatives their investment will be trashed and it is to protect their investment that climate change denial is so heavily funded - by them.

You think you are being clever in your arguments - you are just showing how easily you can be manipulated and how poor your critical thinking has become.

Wake up you dolt.

Adapting means CHANGE. You are resisting change.

Originally posted by finnegan
The idiocy in your post is that nobody advocates living without energy. There are alternative energy sources to fossil fuels however. Usng fossil fuels is irresponsible when there are alternatives.

The thing is not the availability of alternatives, it is the extent to which a very very wealthy mnority profit from their investment in fossil fuels. If we ...[text shortened]... ly you can be manipulated and how poor your critical thinking has become.

Wake up you dolt.

And I'll bring it back a 3rd time to the statement I was addressing i.e.

"Humans do not adapt well to change."

Humans far surpass any other being, insect or animal in adapting to live in any environment this world (or others) can throw at us. Largely thanks to fossil fuels, but if other sources come along, let their viability stand on their own un-subsidised, legs. Frankly if there are alternatives and the goobermint regulated against them, free market resilience would see them grow.

Edit: Please do not edit your post again, let your foot in mouth supremacy live on.

Originally posted by Wajoma
I am stating that your comparing humans to cockroaches in respect to resilience and adaptibllty is ridiculous and no comparison at all, but it is typical of the misanthropic left.

I mentioned cockroaches because they are one of the insects that has proven capable of surviving almost anywhere on earth and have adapted well to human environments. Why you think this has anything to do with the 'left' is beyond me.

Take a look around you twhitehead, everything has been shaped, transported, produced from, made possible by fossil fuels.
I am well aware of that.
But do you have a point to make? Stating the obvious when the obvious has nothing to do with the discussion doesn't win the argument, it just makes you look a fool.