Is being openly racist better than hiding it?

@vivify said
Another tragically ignorant person.

Systemic racism has already been proven, time and time again, for decades. The effects of racism, both past and present, have been proven over and over on this forum, in textbooks, in schools, by government agencies, etc. etc.

If society were as racist as claim you could prove individual acts and get remedies.
Perhaps the reason this is difficult is because racism isn't nearly as prevalent as you believe.
Instead of calling me names and crying like a little baby lets see if individuals
have created their situation in life. If you drop out of school or are convicted of crimes I wouldn't expect your job prospects to be great. We live in a society with free choice and certain groups have in the aggregate made better and worse choices and that explains most of our racial differences.

@shavixmir said
However, as I stated, racism in the US is far more likely to be a consequence / symptom, rather than the cause.

Is it? When an entire ethnic group begins their existence in America as slaves, racism isn't the cause?

When that same group of people finally escape slavery into a society that creates laws specifically meant to prevent their financial, social and political upward mobility (Jim Crow laws, segregation, etc.), is racism really not the cause?

@vivify said
The same people who are ignorant of the facts that CRT aims to teach are the same people who try to stop CRT from being taught, thereby perpetuating that same ignorance.

This is the dark comedy of American racism.

Critical Race theory assumes the conclusion. Certain racial groups in our country commit crimes and drop out of school at a higher rate. It probably is more accurate to say that aggregate outcomes are based on poor decisions.
I wouldn't teach that either. I don't see anything useful about making broad generalizations about people and blaming one group for the outcome of others.

@quackquack said
Critical Race theory assumes the conclusion.

You keep proving my point. Your assertions makes it clear you know nothing about CRT, yet rail against it.

@vivify said
You keep proving my point. Your assertions makes it clear you know nothing about CRT, yet rail against it.

You continually accuse our society of being racist without proving it. I doubt you would use you the same lack of logic in criminal law --- would you arrest and convict people without a trial? If not don't blatantly assert that all of society is racist without presenting a shred of proof.

@quackquack said
You continually accuse our society of being racist without proving it.

After hundreds of post on this forum where I constantly back up what I say with links (including on this thread where I provided a source for redlining) you make this phenomenally baseless claim.

Keep digging that hole you're in.

@vivify said
After hundreds of post on this forum where I constantly back up what I say with links (including on this thread where I provided a source for redlining) you make this phenomenally baseless claim.

Keep digging that hole you're in.

Redlining is illegal. If it is prevalent then it should be easy to prove and get a remedy. If it is not prevalent then you just exaggerating because you have a political motive. I'm guessing, based on the fact you are crying about it on a chess forum, that it isn't nearly as common as you claim and thus you can't really prove it or get a remedy.

@quackquack said
If it is prevalent then it should be easy to prove and get a remedy.

So if people and institutions hide their racism well enough that it's not easy to prove, it doesn't exist?

More stupidity. Keep posting.

@vivify said
So if people and institutions hide their racism well enough that it's not easy to prove, it doesn't exist?

More stupidity. Keep posting.

Now you are admitting that you cannot racism. But instead of letting the issue go you just claim it exists and am frustrated that I want evidence of a specific case before I take action. You realize not everyone wants to implement policy based on things you claim but admit you cannot prove.

@vivify said
Never mind. Thread over. We have the answer: overt racism is far less insidious and frustrating than when it's hidden, as this thread proves.

That's a classic example of assuming the conclusion you set out to prove.

@sh76 said
That's a classic example of assuming the conclusion you set out to prove.

Assuming what conclusion? That racist policies exist? Are you saying claiming that systemic racism doesn't exist? Yes or no?

If yes, and you believe it doesn't exist, then the thousands of posts and discussions you've read and engaged in on this site have been a waste.

If "no", and you do believe systemic racism exists, then what is your problem? Obviously, systemic racism is kept hidden to avoid lawsuits, public shaming and possible legal consequences, right?

So what is your answer? Is systemic racism real or just some unproven boogeyman?

@vivify said
Assuming what conclusion? That racist policies exist? Are you saying claiming that systemic racism doesn't exist? Yes or no?

If yes, and you believe it doesn't exist, then the thousands of posts and discussions you've read and engaged in on this site have been a waste.

If "no", and you do believe systemic racism exists, then what is your problem? Obviously, syste ...[text shortened]... quences, right?

So what is your answer? Is systemic racism real or just some unproven boogeyman?

Let's use the same rule we use for all wrongs in our society: prove your individual case or stop asking for remedies for wrongs you can't prove.

@quackquack said
Let's use the same rule we use for all wrongs in our society: prove your individual case or stop asking for remedies for wrongs you can't prove.

Obviously. No one asked to assume racism exist.

@vivify said
Obviously. No one asked to assume racism exist.

Racist decisions are illegal. Instead of crying about your claims either prove an individual case and get a remedy or see that you cant prove it and accept that you don't deserve a remedy.

@quackquack said
Racist decisions are illegal. Instead of crying about your claims either prove an individual case and get a remedy or see that you cant prove it and accept that you don't deserve a remedy.

What are you talking about? What claim did I make without evidence?