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Debates Forum

  1. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    27 May '10 13:16 / 1 edit
    The newly minted governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, with another classic moment. For those that are not into New Jersey politics, a few months ago, Christie inherited the worst budget deficit in state history from Mr. Goldman Sachs himself, Jon Corzine. His policy has been to balance the budget come Hell or high water without substantially increasing taxes.

    Of the many many budget trims he's proposed is a temporary pay freeze for teachers. Sounds pretty fair, right? Bad economy, big deficit. He's not talking about big layoffs or pay cuts. Just a temporary freeze until the state is out of the woods financially.

    Well, yesterday, he's at some sort of town hall meeting and this veteran teacher gets up and asks this long winded "question" about the pay freeze. This teacher is apparently making $83,000 per year; not too shabby for someone who has off from June to September every year. She starts yammering about how "you're not compensating me for my experience and my education blah blah blah." As if a temporary pay freeze for her is so unjust when unemployment is at 10% and the state has enormous deficits.

    So, your run-of-the-mill politician would say "Well, I sympathize with your concerns, but this is only a necessary temporary measure until [insert standard politician platitudes here]."

    Christie simply looks at her and says "Then don't do it."

    As you can imagine, that brought down the house.

    Christie '12, baby!
  2. 27 May '10 15:59
    Originally posted by sh76
    The newly minted governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, with another classic moment. For those that are not into New Jersey politics, a few months ago, Christie inherited the worst budget deficit in state history from Mr. Goldman Sachs himself, Jon Corzine. His policy has been to balance the budget come Hell or high water without substantially increasing taxes ...[text shortened]... do it."

    As you can imagine, that brought down the house.

    Christie '12, baby!
    Full marks to him. We could do with someone like that here in the UK to deal with the yammering classes.
  3. 27 May '10 16:00 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    The newly minted governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, with another classic moment. For those that are not into New Jersey politics, a few months ago, Christie inherited the worst budget deficit in state history from Mr. Goldman Sachs himself, Jon Corzine. His policy has been to balance the budget come Hell or high water without substantially increasing taxes do it."

    As you can imagine, that brought down the house.

    Christie '12, baby!
    Aaaah.. yes. Let's cheer being rude to people! That's what we need in politicians.

    Just change careers! As if that's easy. He sounds like an idiot to me from what your description is.

    Also, it might be different in New Jersey, but around here teachers may not have to teach all year round, but that doesn't mean that they don't work during the summer. In fact, anyone who intimately know teachers or teachers that I've met said that that's a stupid assumption that people make and I'm hoping Chris Christie isn't stupid enough to have made it himself.

    I'm not saying a temporary pay freeze isn't something that might be necessary and it might be a good idea, but I wouldn't cheer his simple impoliteness just because he somehow put a teacher who has the temerity to not just say "Thank you, may I have another" to a pay freeze in their supposed place.
  4. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    27 May '10 16:04 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by PsychoPawn
    Aaaah.. yes. Let's cheer being rude to people! That's what we need in politicians.

    Just change careers! As if that's easy. He sounds like an idiot to me from what your description is.

    Also, it might be different in New Jersey, but around here teachers may not have to teach all year round, but that doesn't mean that they don't work during the summe just say "Thank you, may I have another" to a pay freeze in their supposed place.
    You call it rudeness.

    I call it honesty.


    You call the teacher's stance bravely standing up to the governor.

    I call her response unrealistic sanctimonious gall.


    All depends on one's perspective, I suppose.


    Oh, and I was a teacher for many years... Still am, in fact, but now only on the college level. Teachers can, and do, take on extra projects during the summer to supplement their teachers salaries.
  5. 27 May '10 16:11
    Originally posted by sh76
    You call it rudeness.

    I call it honesty.


    You call the teacher's stance bravely standing up to the governor.

    I call her response unrealistic sanctimonious gall.


    All depends on one's perspective, I suppose.
    You call it rudeness.

    I call it honesty.


    You can be both at the same time. They're not mutually exclusive. You can also be honest and polite.

    I guess you might prefer someone being honest while being an anal cavity over someone being a polite gentlemen while being equally as honest. Not all have that preference.


    You call the teacher's stance bravely standing up to the governor.

    When did I do that? Please quote me.

    I call her response unrealistic sanctimonious gall.

    Well, you didn't even post what she actually said, not to mention omitting the complete context. You just inserted "blah blah blah" and assumed we'd just agree with you.

    Post all that she said and maybe I'll actually be able to judge whether what she said was what you claim it to be. As it stands, you haven't provided enough to make a real judgement.

    You expect me (or anyone) to just say "Oh yes! How sanctimonious of her to say blah blah blah!!! How horrible!"

    I guess I'd be rude to someone if they just said "blah blah blah" to me at a townhall meeting too.
  6. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    27 May '10 16:30 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by PsychoPawn
    You call it rudeness.

    I call it honesty.


    You can be both at the same time. They're not mutually exclusive. You can also be honest and polite.

    I guess you might prefer someone being honest while being an anal cavity over someone being a polite gentlemen while being equally as honest. Not all have that preference.


    You call the teac rude to someone if they just said "blah blah blah" to me at a townhall meeting too.
    I heard it on the radio. I don't have a transcript of what she said and I don't remember the exact words. She said something about how the government, by freezing her pay, wasn't compensating her fairly for all of her education and experience.

    The sanctimonious gall allegation is not based on the words she used. It's based on her sense of entitlement to a raise at taxpayers' expense when everyone else is struggling to stay employed and dealing with drastically reduced public services in the state.

    The unrealistic allegation is likewise not based on the words she used. It's based on her assumption that her sense of "fairness" and her entitlement to compensation for her education trumps the economic realities as they actually exist.


    Edit: Here's a link: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0510/37817.html

    Oh, and the video:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aw0aBkt8CPA

    Now you can make your own judgment.


    Second edit: LOL. Look at the youtube comments. Half of them ripping the teacher and the other half wishing Christie was their governor or President.
  7. 27 May '10 16:35
    The thing I hate is when politicans go into "spin and grin" mode as they are constantly trying to please everyone around them.

    Christie has a certain kamikaze attitude that says "I don't care about the next election - I'm just going to be as blunt as possible". He dares to go places that only talkshow hosts dare to go. I do agree that he does sometimes (much of the time, actually) cross the line and become rude. But it's a change of pace from the usual bland non-stop campaign mode you get from most politicians.

    And he does have a point here. If that $83,000 teaching job is such a lousy deal, find something better to do. Times are tough. Everyone else is tightening their belt. We've got a budget to balance. You're STILL going to make $83,000 with the freeze. Just deal with it.
  8. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    27 May '10 16:35
    Originally posted by sh76
    The newly minted governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, with another classic moment. For those that are not into New Jersey politics, a few months ago, Christie inherited the worst budget deficit in state history from Mr. Goldman Sachs himself, Jon Corzine. His policy has been to balance the budget come Hell or high water without substantially increasing taxes ...[text shortened]... do it."

    As you can imagine, that brought down the house.

    Christie '12, baby!
    Ah. The sound of opportunity.

    The arrogance of teachers is my key to $$$$$
  9. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    27 May '10 16:39
    Originally posted by Melanerpes
    The thing I hate is when politicans go into "spin and grin" mode as they are constantly trying to please everyone around them.
    Case in point:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zbcif6fNlno

    Sucking up to the voter, no matter how stupid he is...
  10. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    27 May '10 17:39
    Originally posted by Melanerpes
    The thing I hate is when politicans go into "spin and grin" mode as they are constantly trying to please everyone around them.

    Christie has a certain kamikaze attitude that says "I don't care about the next election - I'm just going to be as blunt as possible". He dares to go places that only talkshow hosts dare to go. I do agree that he does sometimes ...[text shortened]... dget to balance. You're STILL going to make $83,000 with the freeze. Just deal with it.
    Christie was hardly being daring; he knew he'd score political points with the public by being nasty to the teacher. Some "hero"; sounds like just another pol pandering to the base.
  11. Standard member sbacat
    Eddie's Dad
    27 May '10 17:43
    It sounds to me like when the teacher said something along the lines of I'm not being fairly compensated for my skill the governor's response amounted to Then find something else to do for which you will be compensated more fairly although he put it more bluntly than that.

    All the teachers I work with know that teaching is not the highest paid profession around going in and still choose to do it. The draw is the benefits, a decent pension, and stability. Now that so many states are in trouble, those compensations may soon be in serious jeopardy. If any of you think this exchange was rude, wait until a state pension plan fails...
  12. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    27 May '10 17:45
    Originally posted by sh76
    The newly minted governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, with another classic moment. For those that are not into New Jersey politics, a few months ago, Christie inherited the worst budget deficit in state history from Mr. Goldman Sachs himself, Jon Corzine. His policy has been to balance the budget come Hell or high water without substantially increasing taxes ...[text shortened]... do it."

    As you can imagine, that brought down the house.

    Christie '12, baby!
    When Christie proposes a pay freeze for police, get back to me.
  13. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    27 May '10 17:52
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    When Christie proposes a pay freeze for police, get back to me.
    If he hasn't, he should. All public employees should get pay freezes until the budget is at least under control.
  14. 27 May '10 18:19
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    Christie was hardly being daring; he knew he'd score political points with the public by being nasty to the teacher. Some "hero"; sounds like just another pol pandering to the base.
    But Christie has actual proposals and budgets that he's trying to get passed. New Jersey's legislature isn't exactly a bastion of Rush Limbaugh fans. His rudeness isn't furthering his cause and might actually end up sabotaging his efforts.

    But irregardless -- if Christie is able to actually get New Jersey's budget back into balance, he will have preformed the impossible. If he's able to finally force New Jersey's voters to understand the need for making tough decisions, I really don't care how he gets it done.
  15. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    27 May '10 18:19
    Originally posted by sh76
    If he hasn't, he should. All public employees should get pay freezes until the budget is at least under control.
    Not in ChristieWorld: http://www.northjersey.com/news/state/politics/91330469_Christie_asks_police_for_few_pay_sacrifices.html