@kevcvs57 saidThere's nothing there I disagree with but that doesn't change the fact that the vote to remove him was illegal under Ukraine's Constitution.
The reality please read.
“ In November 2013, a wave of large-scale protests (known as Euromaidan) erupted in response to President Yanukovych's sudden decision not to sign a political association and free trade agreement with the European Union (EU), instead choosing closer ties to Russia and the Eurasian Economic Union. In February of that year, the Verkhovna Rada (Ukrai ...[text shortened]... reation of the self-proclaimed breakaway states of Donetsk and Luhansk. This sparked the Donbas War.
Parliament (or the part of Parliament that hadn't fled due to the fear of murder by armed extremists) claimed the President had "effectively resigned" but Article 109 of Ukraine's Constitution clearly states that a Presidential resignation is only effective if made in person at a session of Parliament. Obviously this never happened. Nor were impeachment procedures, which required review and approval by Ukraine's Constitutional Court, followed. Thus the removal was clearly contrary to Ukranian law and amounted to de facto approval of an armed coup. That Western countries fell over themselves to immediately recognize the government that took over illegally is just another instance of aggressive Western meddling at Russia's doorstep.
@kevcvs57 saidPutin cannot stomp his way across Europe.
Why are you pretending that it’s either let Putin stomp his way across Europe or have a nuclear war, do you think that Russia is any more suicidal than the Soviets?
This is effing surreal, suddenly the west has to capitulate to the ass wipe Putin or we’re all gonna die. We need to get a grip of ourselves. Putin has to be faced down with conventional forces or there most cer ...[text shortened]... g to limp away from it on newsfeeds just now. ‘Give the Ukrainians the tools and they’ll do the job’
I’ve explained this multiple times to you: logistically impossible. For the exact same reasons the West can’t stomp all across Russia.
The reason fighting this war isn’t in Ukraine’s best interests, are exactly the same as why fighting the US or China when they go on their little benders isn’t productive either. There are far better means of achieving one’s goals than armed resistance in an all-out war.
It’s not WW2, or WW1 or the days of Napoleon anymore. There is a very real risk, when confronting the behemoths of our time, of escalating into a world-wide destruction.
Why the hell do you think NATO is not imposing no-fly zones and the likes?
It’s not good for the ego, I will give you that, but this is an example of a war with only losers. The whole infrastructure destroyed, thousands of dead civilians, millions of displaced people and the world economy on the verge of tatters. Within 1 month.
There were many other ways to oppose Russia on this issue. And most of them far less demanding on the local populace.
Remember: all empires end.
So too will Russia’s. So too will America’s.
But it takes time. And you want them to go out with a whimper and not a bang.
@kevcvs57 saidLibya
Certainly GW along with Tony Blair, remind me again who did you invade under Obama?
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@no1marauder saidThe peoples representatives vote out of power a president who was known to be taking direct orders from a foreign power. Sounds like an impeachment to me but you insist on categorising it as a violent coup even though it’s clear from the figures that the violence was almost entirely carried out by a violent state against initially peaceful protestors, protesting against a president who had blatantly gone against the clear will of the people .
There's nothing there I disagree with but that doesn't change the fact that the vote to remove him was illegal under Ukraine's Constitution.
Parliament (or the part of Parliament that hadn't fled due to the fear of murder by armed extremists) claimed the President had "effectively resigned" but Article 109 of Ukraine's Constitution clearly states that a Presidential re ...[text shortened]... at took over illegally is just another instance of aggressive Western meddling at Russia's doorstep.
I guess government by the people for the people is only the prerogative of a select few nations in the west.
@kevcvs57 saidtrue, but Obama did order bombing strikes in 7 countries.
Certainly GW along with Tony Blair, remind me again who did you invade under Obama?
https://www.cnn.com/2014/09/23/politics/countries-obama-bombed/index.html
@kevcvs57 saidLet me guess, you call it an intervention instead of an invasion.
No invasion of Libya
stop lying and stop being stupid.
Then Russia bombing Ukraine is just an intervention, not an invasion.
Good with you?
@earl-of-trumps saidYes. Obama and then Trump.
Didn't Obama have troops in Syria? I think
WE occupy one third of that country. The oil rich part.
By that standard, Russia should be able to take one third of Ukraine.
@metal-brain saidBut the tanks are an invasion.
Let me guess, you call it an intervention instead of an invasion.
Then Russia bombing Ukraine is just an intervention, not an invasion.
Good with you?
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@kevcvs57 saidConstitutions apparently should be thrown out the window if it serves the interests of Western world domination.
The peoples representatives vote out of power a president who was known to be taking direct orders from a foreign power. Sounds like an impeachment to me but you insist on categorising it as a violent coup even though it’s clear from the figures that the violence was almost entirely carried out by a violent state against initially peaceful protestors, protesting against a pr ...[text shortened]... government by the people for the people is only the prerogative of a select few nations in the west.
If you had bothered to read the links you provided, you'd know that a substantial portion of those killed in the violence were police. But you ignore whatever facts don't fit the propaganda you have been spoon fed. And the Ukraine's President was elected, but no elections deputized the extremists who took over government buildings by force and ignored the agreement reached by that President and elected leaders of the opposition.
@athousandyoung saidThe Government of National Accord got tanks from Egypt.
But the tanks are an invasion.
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20191219-sources-al-sisi-decided-to-supply-haftar-with-tanks-to-storm-tripoli/
The US brought tanks to Iraq.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/03/02/u-s-made-tanks-that-fell-into-militia-hands-in-iraq-sparks-assistance-standoff/
Everybody invades with tanks if they have them.
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@shavixmir saidJesus you are such a wimp
Putin cannot stomp his way across Europe.
I’ve explained this multiple times to you: logistically impossible. For the exact same reasons the West can’t stomp all across Russia.
The reason fighting this war isn’t in Ukraine’s best interests, are exactly the same as why fighting the US or China when they go on their little benders isn’t productive either. There are far b ...[text shortened]... too will America’s.
But it takes time. And you want them to go out with a whimper and not a bang.
1) Ukraine is kicking Russian butt on the ground and Russia is having to resort to long range indiscriminate bombing before it retreats back to the Donbas. You can fight and defeat scumbag emperor’s if you have the gonads for it, look at Afghanistan.
2) By your logic our fear of Putins nuclear option will render NATO and even nations domestic defenders null and void because we wouldn’t want a nuclear war would we.
No Putin has to be stopped in Ukraine he can gain nothing more than he had when he started his blood thirsty invasion.
Crimea, The Donbas and Luhansk regions plus the knowledge he already had that Ukraine would not be joining NATO.
On the down side his demand that NATO retreat west is not going to happen and in fact he’s gonna get a lot more nato on his border than he had before.
Along with crippling sanctions and losing the European oil and gas market these are the costs he will have to pay for invading a sovereign state murdering innocent civilians and threatening nato.
@kevcvs57 said"Ukraine is kicking Russian butt on the ground"
Jesus you are such a wimp
1) Ukraine is kicking Russian butt on the ground and Russia is having to resort to long range indiscriminate bombing before it retreats back to the Donbas. You can fight and defeat scumbag emperor’s if you have the gonads for it, look at Afghanistan.
2) By your logic our fear of Putins nuclear option will render NATO and even nations domestic def ...[text shortened]... e will have to pay for invading a sovereign state murdering innocent civilians and threatening nato.
Is that why Ukraine has not been able to take back any of the territory Russia has taken from them? You are being fed propaganda. Russia is winning.
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@metal-brain saidStop lying and stop being stupid
"Ukraine is kicking Russian butt on the ground"
Is that why Ukraine has not been able to take back any of the territory Russia has taken from them? You are being fed propaganda. Russia is winning.
The situation on the ground is so fluid that news channels struggle to keep up ( Google news channels ) that in itself represents a loss for Putin and his mighty army.
They are having to use the same cowardly tactics they used in Chechnya and are still using in Syria, long range indiscriminate destruction of civilian areas. It’s a spoiler tactic from an impotent halfwit having a terrible twos temper tantrum.