Originally posted by KellyJayDon't get me started on the ills of capitalism😞. If people are in the state they are because they can't manage their money, then it may be best that the state doesn't give them any.
The walfare state isn't the poors fault, it is our fault. The complaints
should be against the system that keeps people in a state of not
being able to be productive, and putting them into a place where
if they tried to be productive they get hurt.
Kelly
They don't need money to survive, they need food, clothing and shelter, and ideally jobs (which involves an economic and social overhaul). Throwing money at them is lazy on our part and ultimately detrimental, as it doesn't encourage the poor to help themselves
The vast majority of those people are there because the state has been failing them for years in terms of social housing, jobs and opportunity - the liberals gave up on them in the 50s as soon as they became a non-voting minority, and the conservatives naturally despised them anyway because, well, they're poor. What makes me laugh most is that no-one benefits more from the teat of the state than the middle class - and the vices of the middle class aren't notably superior to the vices of the underclass when you see them up close.
Originally posted by AmauroteThere is power in keeping the lower class, lower, and many people
The vast majority of those people are there because the state has been failing them for years in terms of social housing, jobs and opportunity - the liberals gave up on them in the 50s as soon as they became a non-voting minority, and the conservatives naturally despised them anyway because, well, they're poor. What makes me laugh most is that no-one ...[text shortened]... iddle class aren't notably superior to the vices of the underclass when you see them up close.
who talk as if they care about the poor, but nothing they do really
causes them to get out of their situation of being poor. The trouble is
that the only ones who can really help the poor be something other
than poor are the poor, when assistance becomes something that
replaces the need for effort to achieve more, or actually works against
effort to achieve more, it is no longer real assistance but a hindrance.
Kelly
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Originally posted by KellyJayI don't believe that for one solitary second - the last time the US government did anything for the poor seriously was during the Great Society era, and even then it didn't press too hard because there were no real votes in it. The truth is that most people are so lazy and selfish that they have no feeling for the poor - they tune them out on their way through the rough neighbours to their workplaces, and equally on their way back to their nice clean suburban homes. If the poor really were individually debased and responsible for their own problems, why is poverty cyclical? Are people seriously advancing the proposition that the middle class are somehow congenitally virtuous and the poor congenitally wicked?
There is power in keeping the lower class, lower, and many people
who talk as if they care about the poor, but nothing they do really
causes them to get out of their situation of being poor. The trouble is
that the only ones who can really help the poor be something other
than poor are the poor, when assistance becomes something that
replaces the need ...[text shortened]... y works against
effort to achieve more, it is no longer real assistance but a hindrance.
Kelly
Originally posted by AmauroteI would not argue that poor are wicked.
I don't believe that for one solitary second - the last time the US government did anything for the poor seriously was during the Great Society era, and even then it didn't press too hard because there were no real votes in it. The truth is that most people are so lazy and selfish that they have no feeling for the poor - they tune them out on their way thro ...[text shortened]... tion that the middle class are somehow congenitally virtuous and the poor congenitally wicked?
However, it would apper as a group they are bad at getting out of poverty. I do believe they have if not equal chance, ample chance to education, work and prosperity.
Messages about health, diet, and wholesome lifestyle choices are failing to get through despite a media and government pushing these messages at everyone, including the poor.
2 edits
Originally posted by AmauroteIt is wrong saying the poor too are some how virtuous and the
I don't believe that for one solitary second - the last time the US government did anything for the poor seriously was during the Great Society era, and even then it didn't press too hard because there were no real votes in it. The truth is that most people are so lazy and selfish that they have no feeling for the poor - they tune them out on their way thro ...[text shortened]... tion that the middle class are somehow congenitally virtuous and the poor congenitally wicked?
rich are some how wicked. If money is some how thought of as power
it should be noted that money does not add to or take away from
one being virtuous or wicked. I know people believe the statement
that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely, but I am
more incline to believe power just reveals corruption and absolute
power will reveal it absolutely. I wish I knew who said the ladder
first I’d love to give him/her credit for that statement. Bottom line
not everyone who is poor today will be tomorrow, not everyone
who was poor yesterday is poor today, only a few stay in that place
generation after generation and it isn’t a matter of color, but a mind
set that keeps them there convinced nothing will change, and it is
someone else job to change it for them and their children.
Kelly
Originally posted by AmauroteCan the theories behind removing 3rd world debt, trade as well as aid be used to tackle 1st world poverty.
The vast majority of those people are there because the state has been failing them for years in terms of social housing, jobs and opportunity - the liberals gave up on them in the 50s as soon as they became a non-voting minority, and the conservatives naturally despised them anyway because, well, they're poor. What makes me laugh most is that no-one ...[text shortened]... iddle class aren't notably superior to the vices of the underclass when you see them up close.
If well as welfare, the poor are encouraged to operate their own small cooperatives with help government and the private sector would this add value to their lives and encourage more middle class values.
Originally posted by invigorateI dont know about the poor in the USA but poor people in my home country tend to have different spending habits (and other life choices) from the wealthier people because of a very different outlook on life. A typical poor person does not forsee a much better future for themselves. They therefore tend to live for the day rather than planning for tommorow. (this has resulted in higer incidences of AIDS in amoungst poorer people.
Why to the poor waste their money?
Today I had the misfortune to go to a 99p store. The shop is effectively full of plastic rubbish, with a few out of date DVDs and snacks. The Poor, a tracksuited welfare supported strand of society were filling their baskets with this tat.
I don't mean to generalise, but poor people often Smoke, have Sky TV, eat Ju ...[text shortened]... m angry about them wasting my hard earned taxes or jealous of their thrill seeking lifestyle.
I also notice a higher incidence of careless spending amoungst people who obtain thier money through dishonest means or gifts rather than working for it.
Originally posted by twhiteheadYes. So we have poor people pissing their money away on the Lotto, slot machines...They are perceived and targeted as prey.
I dont know about the poor in the USA but poor people in my home country tend to have different spending habits (and other life choices) from the wealthier people because of a very different outlook on life. A typical poor person does not forsee a much better future for themselves. They therefore tend to live for the day rather than planning for tommorow. ...[text shortened]... ungst people who obtain thier money through dishonest means or gifts rather than working for it.
