26 Mar 05
1 edit
in another thread, a reliable source, StarValleyWy , has informed me :
"Well let me tell you then. The wholly Indian and one English engineer on site screwd up and let the cionidic trap clog and then it exploded.
Pure laziness and stupidity. It hadn't been "cleaned" in eight days when each shift of "villagers' should have done it daily.
That's what happened. The point is that people MUST be responsible for their actions. The stupid 'villagers' whom the Indian government "insisted" be hired... and the lazy American billionaires who caved in for money... all blew it. There is guilt enough for all. As there should be."
yet at sites on the net i find many claims different from this.
these claims include that it was homocide!
"Union Carbide’s former CEO, Warren Anderson, faces charges of culpable homicide in connection with the disaster, for which India has sought his extradition. He is considered a fugitive from justice for his refusal to return to India to face the charges. Anderson currently is enjoying a comfortable retirement splitting time between Long Island and Florida, playing golf and staying out of the limelight. To date, the U.S. government has done nothing to facilitate Anderson’s extradition. If found guilty, he faces 10 years in prison and a fine. Citing trade secrets, Union Carbide has never disclosed the makeup of the gas that killed thousands."
26 Mar 05
3 edits
Originally posted by flexmoreGood try. Americans were totally to blame. They caved in to the local and national laws of India.
in another thread, a reliable source, StarValleyWy , has informed me that americans were not to blame:
"Well let me tell you then. The wholly Indian and one English engineer on site screwd up and let the cionidic trap clog and then it ...[text shortened]... has never disclosed the makeup of the gas that killed thousands."
That is pretty stupid. Whatever happened... It goes back to the stock holders... who are americans.
Is that clear enough?
MY point was that it is stupid to employ third world turds to do first world technology. Hell. It's like hiring a Brit to build a capitalist database and sales system. That is stupid. They "know" that capitalism is evil, so whatever they design will fail by default. snork.
How you doin' mr. flexible animal droppings? Good I hope.
More or less. Flex. That is.... errrr.... more flex... is good... err. NEVERMIND!
27 Mar 05
Originally posted by StarValleyWyA former US president had a plaque on his desk - "The buck stops here".
Good try. Americans were totally to blame. They caved in to the local and national laws of India.
That is pretty stupid. Whatever happened... It goes back to the stock holders... who are americans.
Is that clear enough?
MY point was that it is stupid to employ third world turds to do first world technology. Hell. It's like hiring a Brit to bui ...[text shortened]... ood I hope.
More or less. Flex. That is.... errrr.... more flex... is good... err. NEVERMIND!
Not any more. Union Carbide owned the plant and they can rightly blame local staff for slackness. Other decisions were known about and approved by Union Carbide management - storing dangerous chemicals and poor capital expenditure on maintenance.
Many of the local staff paid for their negligence with their own or their family's lives. Union Carbide's US managers were called to account for their part in the deaths of thousands - but the Indian Justice system was blocked by the US government.
29 Mar 05
Originally posted by flexmorePoints more close to the truth than SVW's admitted BS can be found here...
in another thread, a reliable source, StarValleyWy , has informed me :
"Well let me tell you then. The wholly Indian and one English engineer on site screwd up and let the cionidic trap clog and then it exploded.
Pure laziness and stupidity. It hadn't been "cleaned" in eight days when each shift of "villagers' should have done it daily.
Tha ...[text shortened]... trade secrets, Union Carbide has never disclosed the makeup of the gas that killed thousands."
http://www.timeforchess.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=21704&page=2
Possibly, the on site crew were a bit lax in their dealings with MIC, but wouldn't everybody take a little less care with something that they had been told was completely harmless than with something that was one of the most deadly chemicals in the world with toxicity levels at 0.02 parts per million.
I would urge noone to rely on SVW's words, as he admits that they are BS, when someone calls him up on it. Do your own search for the facts on Bhopal, as they are widely available on the internet. As a point in note, to discredit SVW's homespun lies, do a google for cionidic. I'm sure you will be as amazed as I was that it returns 0, that's right, a big fat ZERO hits. Doing a further search, you will find out that the gas leak had absolutely nothing to do with a "clogged trap" either. Come on SVW, come out now and tell me that I'm the only 1 intelligent enough to spot your lies and hate filled, racist propoganda, and that your excercise to get people to do their own research worked.
There is no doubt in my mind that the CEO of the company committed homicide on a mass scale. Anybody who fails to translate material for the safe handling of one of the most poisonous substances in the world, to save a few shekels deserves to be taken outside and shot. Hitler may never have personally killed a Jew, but his decisions and policies led to the death of millions. What is the difference between Hitler and Warren Anderson?
BTW: It is now policy for the rich western countries to export the dirty industries to poor countries, where money can be saved on safety, wages, etc, and the people who are adverselty affected by the dirty industries are powerless to act against the multinationals. Here's a memo leaked in 1991 from the World Bank chief Economist, Lawrence Summers:
"Just between you and me, shouldn't the World Bank be encouraging MORE migration of the dirty industries to LDCs [Less developed Countries]?... The measurements of earnings from increased morbidity and mortality. From this point of view a given amount of health impairing pollution should be done in the country with the lowest cost, which will be the country with the lowest wages. I think the economic logic behind dumping a load of toxic waste in the lowest wage country is impeccable and we should face up to that."
People wonder why the world is going to wreck and ruin. Well this guy, along with his "ethics" is thought in universities now. He went on to become the secretary of the treasury in the clinton administration and is now president of Harvard. Why? On the back of a paper which became (and still is ) World Bank policy. A policy based on nothing more than genocide hidden behind economics.
Its disgusting.
D
29 Mar 05
Originally posted by RagnorakPowerful stuff. Rec.
Points more close to the truth than SVW's admitted BS can be found here...
http://www.timeforchess.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=21704&page=2
Possibly, the on site crew were a bit lax in their dealings with MIC, but wouldn't everybody take a little less care with something that they had been told was completely harmless than with something that wa ...[text shortened]... icy based on nothing more than genocide hidden behind economics.
Its disgusting.
D
01 Apr 05
Originally posted by RagnorakWhat?
Bump for SVW
D
Ok.
The big bad "civilized" world exploits the weak and stupid.
Ok? Wow. That took a bunch of soul searching.
The question is... What do we do about it? It will get nothing but worse until we recognize that we are too many on this globe with too little resource. I know what needs to be done. What do you say? Bump.
01 Apr 05
Originally posted by StarValleyWyNo,
What?
Ok.
The big bad "civilized" world exploits the weak and stupid.
Ok? Wow. That took a bunch of soul searching.
The question is... What do we do about it? It will get nothing but worse until we recognize that we are too many on this globe with too little resource. I know what needs to be done. What do you say? Bump.
just tell me some more about cionidic traps. I had a bad night's sleep, and could do with a laugh.
Also, explain your compulsive need to lie?
Thanks,
D
01 Apr 05
Originally posted by RagnorakWell. There was this third world which thought that only by having all industry small and contained in the cottage could we all be equal in the sight of the great shiva.
No,
just tell me some more about cionidic traps. I had a bad night's sleep, and could do with a laugh.
Also, explain your compulsive need to lie?
Thanks,
D
So we thought really, really small.
Then along came a powerful evil. Progress. We tried to destroy and deny it. But it came and killed us in our sleep.
We all died because of magic.
snork.
Or... Greedy people exploited the stupid to make a buck.
What is so difficult in understanding our basic nature?
02 Apr 05
1 edit
Originally posted by StarValleyWyThen there was an American company who sold insecticide. And they decided they wanted to sell it in India - and the Indian Government said fine as long as you make it in India.
Well. There was this third world which thought that only by having all industry small and contained in the cottage could we all be equal in the sight of the great shiva.
So we thought really, really small.
Then along came a power ...[text shortened]... a buck.
What is so difficult in understanding our basic nature?
So Union Carbide built a plant and staffed it with American engineers to train local chemcial engineers. But the pesticide did not sell well - many farmers could not afford it or the equipment to apply it safely. So the plant lost money and money for maintenance and safety was cut back. Union Carbide, as majority owner of the Bhopal site knew how to run a safe plant - but they did things they would never permit to happen in their US plants.
How did Union Carbide limit their losses?
Switching off the refrigeration units
Cutting back on corrosion inspection on lines containing Methyl Isocyanate. It was the reaction of Methyl Isocyanate with water which caused the pressure build up and explosion,
Reducing worker numbers to one man in the control room and only a handful on site
Not replacing faulty monitoring equipment -so pressure and temperature of the Methyl Isocyanate tanks could not be monitored in the Control Room
No back up systems for critical plants and manual alarms
Storing massive quantities of lethal Methyl Isocyanate (nearly 70 tonnes) where in US plants, it was processed immediately so less than half a tonne was stored
Union Carbide knew of these dangers from their own inspectors - and did not even send safety reports to the local managers.
All of these things were the responsibilty of the owners of the Bhopal chemical plant - 8000 people died in the immediate aftermath of the disaster. And people contine to die as the result of the penypinching of Union Carbide.
Warren Anderson, Chairman of Union Carbide has been called to account for culpable homicide, criminal conspiracy and other serious offences. He has never been extradited to India to face the resullts of his actions.