@vivify saidThat's not possible under a law passed last December:
If Trump is elected he will pull out of NATO and it will fall apart. He's a progressive's dream.
"Under the provision, a president would be required to notify key committees in both the House and the Senate no later than 180 days before deliberating whether to "suspend, terminate, denounce, or withdraw" from NATO. If a president pressed forward, a withdrawal would require an act of Congress or two-thirds of the senators present to approve of such an action."
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-nato-withdraw-congress-defense-bill-2023-12
@vivify saidThe UK's nukes are all on their four Vanguard class submarines. They don't have ICBMs based on their island and they don't have nuclear bombs any more either.
That depends on how capable their missile defense systems are. It's doubtful that the eastern bloc nations have anti-missile defenses as sophisticated as Russia's.
Unless France and the U.K. have nukes elsewhere, like a base in another country or nuclear submarines (I have no idea if they do) Russia only needs to worry about nuclear warheads coming from France and the U ...[text shortened]... o get most NATO nations to surrender.
But that's only in a scenario where the U.S. has left NATO,
France has the Triomphant-class submarines as well as some nuclear bombs which can be carried on the Charles du Gaulle aircraft carrier's Rafale fighter-bombers.
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@no1marauder saidThank goodness. Our government finally did something right.
That's not possible under a law passed last December:
"Under the provision, a president would be required to notify key committees in both the House and the Senate no later than 180 days before deliberating whether to "suspend, terminate, denounce, or withdraw" from NATO. If a president pressed forward, a withdrawal would require an act of Congress or two-thirds of the ...[text shortened]... uch an action."
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-nato-withdraw-congress-defense-bill-2023-12
@athousandyoung saidThanks for that.
The UK's nukes are all on their four Vanguard class submarines. They don't have ICBMs based on their island and they don't have nuclear bombs any more either.
France has the Triomphant-class submarines as well as some nuclear bombs which can be carried on the Charles du Gaulle aircraft carrier's Rafale fighter-bombers.
@shavixmir saidWell, that's the thing: the EU does not really protect one another.
It's extremely bad diplomacy.
Most of the countries are EU, so are protected anyway. Why pay more, if the US is threatening to feed you to the dogs?
NATO is a protection pact. trump's comments don't increase mutual protection. It spews forth disparity and friction.
And what sort of international signal are you sending by telling Russia they can invade another co ...[text shortened]... t jobs internationally as it is.
The US Bred him, let them feed him, keep him and suck his arse.
They are not capable of carrying out significant military operations abroad unless we are talking about policing the Central African Republic or some such, and even then, Wagner would do a better job of it.
The EU can certainly pass off their old equipment to the Ukrainians and throw little envelopes of money into the gloveboxes, but nobody thinks that the EU would be a serious obstacle to much of anyone.
I mean, sure, they could repel a Syrian attack if one came but imagine trying to ship these armies of drag queens over to the Middle East to fight a war. It just couldn't be done, and it never would be: there is no fighting spirit in Europe west of Prague that can be found in anyone but drug addicts & football hooligans.
@philokalia saidYou have absolutely no idea of what Europe or the EU are capable of.
Well, that's the thing: the EU does not really protect one another.
They are not capable of carrying out significant military operations abroad unless we are talking about policing the Central African Republic or some such, and even then, Wagner would do a better job of it.
The EU can certainly pass off their old equipment to the Ukrainians and throw little ...[text shortened]... g spirit in Europe west of Prague that can be found in anyone but drug addicts & football hooligans.
You mistake diplomacy for weakness, get your history mixed up with the present and don’t take international developement into any form of serious consideration.
Russia can’t handle a proxy war in Ukraine. And farmers manage to beat the US everywhere they go: Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam.
You do not comprehend the basics of warfare and come here and shout about matters you have no inkling of understanding over.
Like a maga hat wearer screaming that Einstein knew nothing (I was going to say Socrates, because that’s where the irony lay, but it would have been over your head).
Learn about logistics & supply lines, grow a back bone, then come back for your next spanking.
@Metal-Brain
You have ZERO idea of what NATO is all about in your pathetic zeal to support your real boss Putin.
NATO NEVER asks for money from ANY country. They ask those countries to spend the money ON THEIR OWN DEFENSE you commie POS.
Trump does not understand that either.
Trump IS a traitor RIGHT NOW for saying he ENCOURAGES "anyone" to attack who ever they want, and we know good and well 'Anyone' mean only one person which happens to be your boss PUTIN.
There is NOTHING you can do or say that will change ANYONE'S mind about that.
@sonhouse saidYou mean NATO countries are free to buy all of their weapons from Russia and the USA would be fine with that? Nope. If most of Europe held Rubles more than US dollars the USA would not be so confident they would use those US dollars to buy US weapons, would they?
@Metal-Brain
You have ZERO idea of what NATO is all about in your pathetic zeal to support your real boss Putin.
NATO NEVER asks for money from ANY country. They ask those countries to spend the money ON THEIR OWN DEFENSE you commie POS.
Trump does not understand that either.
Trump IS a traitor RIGHT NOW for saying he ENCOURAGES "anyone" to attack who ever they want, an ...[text shortened]... o be your boss PUTIN.
There is NOTHING you can do or say that will change ANYONE'S mind about that.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-nato-summit-trump-arms/trump-ready-to-help-some-nato-states-buy-u-s-arms-idUSKBN1K22US/
Trump is just a puppet of the military industrial complex. Is that so hard for you to believe? You believe every other bad allegation about him. Are you defending Trump now?
@shavixmir saidWhat makes you think the USA will honor it's NATO defense promises even if they do meet their military spending of 2% of GDP? The USA might just decide to let another NATO member fight on their own to inflict the maximum amount of damage to the enemy. That way the USA could keep Russia busy at another front in the war while Poland (for example) fights for it's very survival as a nation without any choice.
trump has invited Russia to attack NATO members not paying the full amount agreed on (2% GDP).
trump is a moron.
@Philokalia
Yeah that’s the point really, they cannot because they haven’t had to, but now they are realising that the US is an unreliable partner and they will have to gear up defend themselves.
I think non Russian Europe could be a potent defensive pact, at least against Russia, they’d have to pull back from the far east and any theatres that do not offer a direct territorial threat. If everyone did that the world would be a lot less dangerous place to live
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@metal-brain saidI don’t think Western Europe will let Poland fight the Russians on their own. One nation deciding not to honour article five even though they invoked it themselves doesn’t mean the rest of the pact will sit back and wait until Russia rocks up at their door, if that happens the US / European alliance is done and it’s maybe no bad thing. I’d rather fight Russia without the US than fight China with them.
What makes you think the USA will honor it's NATO defense promises even if they do meet their military spending of 2% of GDP? The USA might just decide to let another NATO member fight on their own to inflict the maximum amount of damage to the enemy. That way the USA could keep Russia busy at another front in the war while Poland (for example) fights for it's very survival as a nation without any choice.
@shavixmir saidI came off as rude - and I meant to - but I want to say this: You can't be the best at everything, Shav!
You have absolutely no idea of what Europe or the EU are capable of.
You mistake diplomacy for weakness, get your history mixed up with the present and don’t take international developement into any form of serious consideration.
Russia can’t handle a proxy war in Ukraine. And farmers manage to beat the US everywhere they go: Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam.
You do not ...[text shortened]... ).
Learn about logistics & supply lines, grow a back bone, then come back for your next spanking.
Years ago while drinking with some Europeans, I told a German a true story of suffering in the Holocaust that I found shocking, and this large, handsome German man actually began weeping and excused himself... Myself and some Koreans were taken aback... But, we knew this was absolutely because he is an exceedingly genteel & civilized person of great moral character.
I met with the Norwegian national Taekwondo team and these strong, strapping men, all athletes larger than me, were such kind, charitable people with great hearts...
My impression of Europeans is that they are (1) tall and (2) wouldn't hurt a fly.
My impression of E. Europeans is that they are big guys who would kick your ass for the right reason. In fact, I've seen them do it.
My buddies tell me that in the foreign mercenary companies, it is often third world people commanded about by older Eastern European NCOs and officers, and sometimes some units made up all of Americans or SOuth Americans... I am sure the W. Europeans do exist in large numbers in the right places, but it is just not so much in the character of modern Western European people....
Because you are kind, civilized, peace oriented people.
You can be physically tough, but our weak, old men in Asia will boil a squid alive and comment about how tasty it looks while its tentacles shrivel up. Our women are different because sometimes they will stab the squid in the head before they put it on the grill.
Some of my peers are old enough to remember seeing the dog hoisted up by the neck and beaten like a pinata by the village men because they believed the fear and pain made the meat tastier... But yes, the Koreans in their 30s and 40s are the first people to silently retreat somewhere else and weep when they saw this happen, and now all the old people are reforming themselves over this...
That is why, between the years 1910 and the 1990s, it was not difficult for Koreans to brutalize their enemies and one another then go drink it off.
But I can't really do that.
And I know the European men can't do that.
Just face the facts: you can get a gym membership and get your bodyfat down to 5%, pure muscle, ready to do VERY SERIOUS Mixed Martial Arts... But you don't have what it takes to kill a dog, let alone a man...
And that's beautiful. That's the greatest thing you can say about a man.
God bless you.
@kevcvs57 saidAll people have a way of stepping up to the plate and swinging when they have to.
@Philokalia
Yeah that’s the point really, they cannot because they haven’t had to, but now they are realising that the US is an unreliable partner and they will have to gear up defend themselves.
I think non Russian Europe could be a potent defensive pact, at least against Russia, they’d have to pull back from the far east and any theatres that do not offer a direct territorial threat. If everyone did that the world would be a lot less dangerous place to live
If a man's family is hurting, he can become a beast.
If a man's family has only known pain, he is already one.
I have confidence that the Europeans can become great warriors, just like anyone can, but it will take a minute, IMO.
Great tch, great brains, great everything - but it's an error to pretend you have what it takes to be like the guys in the favelas and ghettos of Siberia or hellscapes of Syria.
You can learn some things overnight to some degree but if you weren't actually born next to a furnace you'll never quite be used to the heat like those that were.
... and it is important for me to say that...
I sometimes walk through the foreign ghetto of hard looking factory workers from south & southeast Asia and I respect them in the same special way that I respect my grandfather: poverty & difficulties have made them profound and there's nothing I can do to make up that gap between us by reading books.
@kevcvs57 saidWho says Russia will come to the door of another country? Russia does not have the military capability to do that without starting a nuclear war. A country from western Europe has little incentive to help a country in eastern Europe until that eastern country has lost and Russia invades yours, but that is not likely. You keep swallowing stupid propaganda from the west that makes no sense. Russia doesn't have the troops to do that. It is simply impossible for Russia to invade multiple European countries on it's own.
I don’t think Western Europe will let Poland fight the Russians on their own. One nation deciding not to honour article five even though they invoked it themselves doesn’t mean the rest of the pact will sit back and wait until Russia rocks up at their door, if that happens the US / European alliance is done and it’s maybe no bad thing. I’d rather fight Russia without the US than fight China with them.
You were duped into believing Russia can do impossible things. Only China is capable of that kind of expansion. Russia doesn't have enough people and their economy is too small. China has none of those limitations which is why the western empire wants war with China sooner rather than later. Soon China will be the most powerful country in the world. Only a hasty war with China can prevent that from happening.
Now you know why the USA wants to pick a fight over Taiwan. A war with China is the only way to prevent them from becoming #1 in everything. China is poised to become the most powerful country on the planet.
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@philokalia saidNo we will rely more on those great brains and centuries of shutting off to the suffering of our enemies, one on one combat is something you have to do if you cannot kill from a distance. Trust me europe has its own favelas.
All people have a way of stepping up to the plate and swinging when they have to.
If a man's family is hurting, he can become a beast.
If a man's family has only known pain, he is already one.
I have confidence that the Europeans can become great warriors, just like anyone can, but it will take a minute, IMO.
Great tch, great brains, great everything - but ...[text shortened]... ave made them profound and there's nothing I can do to make up that gap between us by reading books.
We will need to shore up Ukraine at least until we are ready defend Poland and the Baltic states, also worth remembering that the attacking force requires a 3:1 numerical advantage and we saw what happened to the blitzkrieg approach taken by the Russians in their initial assault on Ukraine. On a modern battlefield tanks without masses of infantry to protect them are just so much scrap metal.
The most vulnerable are the Baltic states but that simply means focusing resources on that region.