@shavixmir saidNational security specialist Tom Nichols of The Atlantic expressed starkly just what this means: “The leader of one of America’s two major political parties has just signaled to the Kremlin that if elected, he would not only refuse to defend Europe, but he would gladly support Vladimir Putin during World War III and even encourage him to do as he pleases to America’s allies.” Former NATO supreme commander Wesley Clark called Trump’s comments “treasonous.”
trump has invited Russia to attack NATO members not paying the full amount agreed on (2% GDP).
trump is a moron.
@Phranny
There was an agreement upon joining NATO. 2% GDP on defense.
Those that do not honor the agreement should be kicked out of NATO. They are supposed to be able to defend other NATO members if attacked. How can they do that if they slack and have no military power?
There is merit to Trump's position. Are we to let all NATO members slack off and renege on the agreement and still defend them? How are they going to defend any other members if attacked?
NATO should not even exist though. The USSR does not exist anymore and NATO expansion caused the Ukraine war.
@metal-brain saidSo, it’s a protection racket?
@Phranny
There was an agreement upon joining NATO. 2% GDP on defense.
Those that do not honor the agreement should be kicked out of NATO. They are supposed to be able to defend other NATO members if attacked. How can they do that if they slack and have no military power?
There is merit to Trump's position. Are we to let all NATO members slack off and renege on the ag ...[text shortened]... ld not even exist though. The USSR does not exist anymore and NATO expansion caused the Ukraine war.
If NATO feels it shouldn’t protect a member nation for whichever reason, then NATO should exclude that nation from the pact.
Until such time, it’s a pact.
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@philokalia saidYeah. Very trump… large man weeping… BS.
I came off as rude - and I meant to - but I want to say this: You can't be the best at everything, Shav!
Years ago while drinking with some Europeans, I told a German a true story of suffering in the Holocaust that I found shocking, and this large, handsome German man actually began weeping and excused himself... Myself and some Koreans were taken aback... But, we knew ...[text shortened]... n...
And that's beautiful. That's the greatest thing you can say about a man.
God bless you.
Between 1910 and 1990 Europeans murdered civilians on a scale that never before has been seen on the planet.
Germans bloody industrialised murder.
Did you see what the Dutch did to the Indonesians? The French? The Italians?
Seriously. You have no fukking idea what Europeans are like.
@shavixmir saidAny NATO nation that does not spend the 2% of GDP is in violation of that pact.
So, it’s a protection racket?
If NATO feels it shouldn’t protect a member nation for whichever reason, then NATO should exclude that nation from the pact.
Until such time, it’s a pact.
That makes the pact null and void.....or should. If you let a few nations get away with it why shouldn't others follow? Are you going to tolerate all nations reneging on the pact and still protect them when they are incapable of protecting us?
How do you know NATO nations will not fail to protect another NATO nation if one is attacked? And the weaker these nations are the less likely they will come in defense of another NATO nation. Is NATO a binding pact? What is to stop the Netherlands from deciding they are too far away from the front lines of WW3 to get involved yet, especially if who started WW3 is contested?
In reality NATO is a huge joke. You have no idea if many NATO nations will honor the pact and since they already violated the minimum military spending part of that pact you can see why I am laughing about it. Right? Even the USA probably only intends to defend the front lines of WW3 anyway. If the Netherlands gets nuked simply because they host US nukes to destroy why would the USA go that far west away from the front lines against Russia? If the goal is to invade Russia why would the USA spread themselves to thin to west Europe? They would leave the Netherlands to fight on their own. That is what would happen.
NATO has never been adequately tested to see if nations would honor the pact in a really nasty conflict. The odds that they all will is pretty slim in my opinion.
@phranny saidIf a nation doesnt care enough to pay their share, why should the US care to support them?
National security specialist Tom Nichols of The Atlantic expressed starkly just what this means: “The leader of one of America’s two major political parties has just signaled to the Kremlin that if elected, he would not only refuse to defend Europe, but he would gladly support Vladimir Putin during World War III and even encourage him to do as he pleases to America’s allies.” Former NATO supreme commander Wesley Clark called Trump’s comments “treasonous.”
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@mott-the-hoople saidBut they are paying their share this is a nod to the selfish side of the US and an incentive to Americas enemies to engage in election interference in order to get their boy trump in the White House again, hey it worked in 2016 so worth a try.
If a nation doesnt care enough to pay their share, why should the US care to support them?
@kevcvs57 said"But they are paying their share"
But they are paying their share this is a nod to the selfish side of the US and an incentive to Americas enemies to engage in election interference in order to get their boy trump in the White House again, hey it worked in 2016 so worth a try.
Lying idiot
@shavixmir saidYeah, how old are you, Shav?
Yeah. Very trump… large man weeping… BS.
Between 1910 and 1990 Europeans murdered civilians on a scale that never before has been seen on the planet.
Germans bloody industrialised murder.
Did you see what the Dutch did to the Indonesians? The French? The Italians?
Seriously. You have no fukking idea what Europeans are like.
Are you an old man who was there during the rough years?
We also know that the 1910 to 1990 number hinges on you lumping yourself in with eastern Europeans.
We all know you aren't made of the same stuff as the Albanians who traffic the women into your brothels over in the Nutterlands.
@kevcvs57 saidOK, thank yuo for your feeback
No we will rely more on those great brains and centuries of shutting off to the suffering of our enemies, one on one combat is something you have to do if you cannot kill from a distance. Trust me europe has its own favelas.
We will need to shore up Ukraine at least until we are ready defend Poland and the Baltic states, also worth remembering that the attacking force requi ...[text shortened]...
The most vulnerable are the Baltic states but that simply means focusing resources on that region.
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@metal-brain saidWhat you're describing is not a pact, that's a business. Like paying for security guards.
Any NATO nation that does not spend the 2% of GDP is in violation of that pact.
That makes the pact null and void.....or should.
Think of it in terms of someone who's delinquent on their taxes; should they not receive police protection?
NATO was merely about signing on the dotted line, you'd have a point. It's not a club you to pay to join, NATO is an alliance united by political, philosophical and cultural bonds; not receipts.
@philokalia saidUtter rubbish.
Yeah, how old are you, Shav?
Are you an old man who was there during the rough years?
We also know that the 1910 to 1990 number hinges on you lumping yourself in with eastern Europeans.
We all know you aren't made of the same stuff as the Albanians who traffic the women into your brothels over in the Nutterlands.
Germany, Holland, France and Britain are not Eastern Europe.
And you obviously know nothing about me.
@shavixmir said... You didn't read me post.
Utter rubbish.
Germany, Holland, France and Britain are not Eastern Europe.
And you obviously know nothing about me.
Your absurd statement that you Europeans are so tough between the years 1910 and 1990 hinges on YOU (Western European) are in the same category as the Yugoslavians in the 1980s who dealt with genocide...
I thought Dutch people were just brilliant - guess that is something more for EDM and economics.
When I think of you, I like to think of a 24 year old man in the year 1994 with a bald head and a windbreaker dancing like an electrified noodle.
And I think that's beautiful.
@metal-brain saidAgain.
Any NATO nation that does not spend the 2% of GDP is in violation of that pact.
That makes the pact null and void.....or should. If you let a few nations get away with it why shouldn't others follow? Are you going to tolerate all nations reneging on the pact and still protect them when they are incapable of protecting us?
How do you know NATO nations will not fail to ...[text shortened]... honor the pact in a really nasty conflict. The odds that they all will is pretty slim in my opinion.
Just. Stop. Lying.
@philokalia said"The rough years."
Yeah, how old are you, Shav?
Are you an old man who was there during the rough years?
We also know that the 1910 to 1990 number hinges on you lumping yourself in with eastern Europeans.
We all know you aren't made of the same stuff as the Albanians who traffic the women into your brothels over in the Nutterlands.
Said the American.