General
10 Sep 03
10 Sep 03
that's what Mr. Bush is asking from each & every American family, $1000 to sort out the problems in Iraq (please correct me if I'm getting the figures wrong).
Anyone feel a bit annoyed about this, concidering the state the economy is in already? Anyone quite happy that they are giving to help a poorer country? Anyone not convinced that after the $87 billion is spent that things will be truly better?
10 Sep 03
............there was an old lady that swallowed a cow
I'm not sure how she swallowed a cow
She swallowed the cow to catch the goat
She swallowed the goat to catch the dog
She swallowed the dog to catch the cat
She swallowed the cat to catch the bird
She swallowed the bird to catch the spider
She swallowed the spider to catch the fly
I dont know why she swallowed the fly
perhaps she'll die
well........she ended up swallowing a horse and yep
she died
10 Sep 03
Originally posted by belgianfreakPerhaps Bush should also ask the oil companies and arms manufacturers who directly benefitted from the conflict to contribute.
that's what Mr. Bush is asking from each & every American family, $1000 to sort out the problems in Iraq (please correct me if I'm getting the figures wrong).
Anyone feel a bit annoyed about this, concidering the state the economy is in already? Anyone quite happy that they are giving to help a poorer country? Anyone not convinced that after the $87 billion is spent that things will be truly better?
10 Sep 03
Originally posted by belgianfreakFirst... go look at the US annual budget chart at..
that's what Mr. Bush is asking from each & every American family, $1000 to sort out the problems in Iraq (please correct me if I'm getting the figures wrong).
Anyone feel a bit annoyed about this, concidering the state the economy is in already? Anyone quite happy that they are giving to help a poorer country? Anyone not convinced that after the $87 billion is spent that things will be truly better?
http://www.fms.treas.gov/annualreport/cs2002/outlay.pdf
The US law requires that a supplemental budget draft be put forward for troops stationed overseas. The point is, 67 billions would have been expended in either case. This leaves 20 billions in aid to the people of Iraq. Money well spent or money wasted? Who knows. Check back in ten years and see how many new mass graves have sprung up AFTER THE EXPENDITURE.
Of the more than 2010 BILLIONS for a given year [2001 as shown] and considering that we would be paying for the military whether they are in alabama or iraq... chump change IF... here comes the if...
1 - You put any value whatsoever on human life. Count the hundreds of mass graves and killings from Saddam's era.
2 - You think human rights and freedom are worth money,lives and effort.
3 - You are not jealous that somebody is getting the green backs and that leaves fewer for you.
10 Sep 03
Originally posted by stagefrightThey pay taxes like everyone else... just a much larger percentage. Examine US corporate law and you will see that companies pay most of the 2 trillion dollars into the treasury each year. But... what is a corporation? Me, and my neighbors. We hold the stock, we earn our living there and we share in the profits and losses if we own equity in the company. Where in the world did this "evil corporations" thing come from? Small minds? I think so.
Perhaps Bush should also ask the oil companies and arms manufacturers who directly benefitted from the conflict to contribute.
11 Sep 03
Originally posted by StarValleyWyIt's not "evil corporations" - that's trivialising the issue by using overly simplistic language; it's the abuse of power by government officials and the individuals controlling the corporations that you should be worried about (and don't kid yourself that your small shareholding gives you any kind of influence). It's not just a coincidence that as Bush Sr.'s secretary of defence, Dick Cheney steered millions of dollars in government business to a private military contractor - whose parent company just happened to give him a high-paying job after he left the government. Cheney's interests in Halliburton are now calculated as being worth in excess of $50m and Halliburton and its subsidiaries continue to be given ever more lucrative contracts by the Pentagon. And don't even get me started on the oil industry...
They pay taxes like everyone else... just a much larger percentage. Examine US corporate law and you will see that companies pay most of the 2 trillion dollars into the treasury each year. But... what is a corporation? Me, and my neighbors. We hold the stock, we earn our living there and we share in the profits and losses if we own equity in the company. Where in the world did this "evil corporations" thing come from? Small minds? I think so.
Maybe you should open your eyes to what really goes on.
11 Sep 03
1 edit
Originally posted by stagefrightOne big giant SO? So What? Do you have a point? Did the people do the work they contracted for? That is the only issue. Duh! Wake up and pull your head out. It smells better out here.😠 Have fun at your weekly "Geez I Am Picked On By Evil Non-Commies" meeting.😏
It's not "evil corporations" - that's trivialising the issue by using overly simplistic language; it's the abuse of power by government officials and the individuals controlling the corporations that you should be worried about (an ...[text shortened]... try...
Maybe you should open your eyes to what really goes on.
Don't flatter yourself. Nothing you could say about the "oil companies" would be of any interest whatsoever. You know about as much about that as you obviously know about capitalism. Nothing...
11 Sep 03
Originally posted by StarValleyWyActually, SVW, the issue is that there wasn't the usual competition for the contracts. The normal bidding process was not followed and it just happened to turn out that the contracts were awarded to companies to which the people awarding them had personal ties.
One big giant SO? So What? Do you have a point? Did the people do the work they contracted for? That is the only issue.
11 Sep 03
1 edit
Originally posted by richjohnsonRich,
Actually, SVW, the issue is that there wasn't the usual competition for the contracts. The normal bidding process was not followed and it just happened to turn out that the contracts were awarded to companies to which the people awarding them had personal ties.
No argument with you there. But I have to ask again... If you have to have a system in place in a month and money doesn't matter... only results.... and you know who can get the job done because you know them personally? And you know you are going to catch hell for perceived theft and still have the guts to hire the "people you trust"... Who is more brave? The vice-president or Dennis Kucinich, who is just pissed as all hell that he can't become the "supereme leader" of the commie states of america?
(apologies if i miss-smelled dennis's name... i don't like him really, really lots)😵
11 Sep 03
Originally posted by StarValleyWySaddam's era is just a silly excuse to use its power.
First... go look at the US annual budget chart at..
http://www.fms.treas.gov/annualreport/cs2002/outlay.pdf
The US law requires that a supplemental budget draft be put forward for troops stationed overseas. The point is, 67 billions would have been expended in either case. This leaves 20 billions in aid to the people of Iraq. Money well spent or m ...[text shortened]... You are not jealous that somebody is getting the green backs and that leaves fewer for you.
It is important to point that US and the world is getting out of oil, maybe I would have done the same US Did, for my benefit, but to belive that Saddams and all the other arguments is really a Sin.😛
11 Sep 03
Originally posted by Boby FisherHey Boby... here is your anti US rant from April... you said it better there. So we hate you too. So? I still think you are a heartless creep.
Saddam's era is just a silly excuse to use its power.
It is important to point that US and the world is getting out of oil, maybe I would have done the same US Did, for my benefit, but to belive that Saddams and all the other arguments is really a Sin.😛
12 Apr '03 09:52 Boby Fisher
This is for oil just oil, there are many countries with problems worse than irak but they dont have what irak has, to kill people because of oil is moral? or are you thinking that saddam had powerfull guns? dont dream bush and blair are doing well for them and for us people thinking in future but economically not moraly, irak has more oil than us, cananda, mexico and more countries together that is why they are there. Bush thanks GOD every day for 911 each day
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11 Sep 03
1 edit
Originally posted by StarValleyWyWell, obviously you have to do it, what else could you do?
Rich,
No argument with you there. But I have to ask again... If you have to have a system in place in a month and money doesn't matter... only results.... and you know who can get the job done because you know them personally? And ...[text shortened]... smelled dennis's name... i don't like him really, really lots)😵
11 Sep 03
1 edit
Originally posted by iamatigerI'll have to plead to a little laziness here. I really don't even know what the various contracts were for... or if they have been started or completed... or if the jobs, if done, were done on time and correctly. I know of the general issue, but not the details. Lazy, pure and simple.😛 I'll try to educate on it and let you know if the veep did good or bad. But on principle... i don't have a problem with "outright hire" as opposed to "bid" system. In my home building business i used the best people for my business. Fast. High quality. Then price. After working together on a few houses, they knew to spend enough effort and money to always do good work. I always paid them if they ran into a problem.
Well, obviously you have to do it, what else could you do?
12 Sep 03
Originally posted by StarValleyWySWV - where do you get off being so personally offensive? If you can't conduct a sensible discussion without resorting to personal insults then maybe you shouldn't bother.
One big giant SO? So What? Do you have a point? Did the people do the work they contracted for? That is the only issue. Duh! Wake up and pull your head out. It smells better out here.😠 Have fun at your weekly "Geez I Am Picked On By Evil Non-Commies" meeting.😏
Don't flatter yourself. Nothing you could say about the "oil companies" would be of ...[text shortened]... whatsoever. You know about as much about that as you obviously know about capitalism. Nothing...
In any event, your "arguments" are full of holes and by your own admission you've got no idea of the facts at the heart of this issue - so why don't you run along to another thread where you can actually contribute something of worth.
To spell it out in very simple terms you can understand - I'm not criticising capitalism you idiot, merely the flawed system of awarding very lucrative contracts to companies without regard as to which one is actually best placed to carry them out. Still, your unquestioning and naive trust in the system is very touching. 😉
12 Sep 03
Originally posted by stagefrightOh thank God! I didn't realize you were setting in on the negotiations between State, Defence and the White House. I'll rest better now, knowing that you are a first hand witness to all these terrible attrocities of "appropriation". I can't thank you enough. Fill us in on all the details that you observed in all these meetings. You know.. Contracts with... amounts... schedules... that sort of thing. I realize that you are limited by your "top secret" security rating... but please... Oh Please! ... on stuff that you CAN share... feel free to share... let us know exactly what happened.
SWV - where do you get off being so personally offensive? If you can't conduct a sensible discussion without resorting to personal insults then maybe you shouldn't bother.
In any event, your "arguments" are full of holes and by your own admission you've got no idea of the facts at the heart of this issue - so why don't you run along to another ...[text shortened]... to carry them out. Still, your unquestioning and naive trust in the system is very touching. 😉
Thanks again for your vast, informed, inside position. It makes me sleep better knowing you are on the job at all of these "cheating" sessions. Be sure to write it all down. We need a record you know.
Oh, by the way... I don't usually get away with it. Most people who actually know nothing... get really offended when I point out the obvious fact that they know nothing.😲 Some of them even get stage fright and go into terrible rants against me. A never ending source of amusement, that.