I don't get it! Why cheat?

Originally posted by Bedlam
At a guess
1)Wanting people to think they are good
2)Laziness
3)Cheating so that your team wins something


I remember when the top player here was banned for cheating. A lot of people thought he was geniune and he had a good standing/status on the site. Maybe being number 1 made him feel better about himself?

Bedlam you have a very good point.

Originally posted by davidgrayson
We all play for various reasons. Most of us play just because it's fun
and we like chess. There's no money in it, there's no glory in it.
Even if someone is the top player, no one really knows who they are.
So what is the point in logging on and having an engine play for you?
These guys are really sick.

I will not read all the posts here,but some not so obvious reasons why some players cheat are as follows:
1.Some sites DO have more cheaters than others and without mentioning which ones,some players say to themselves,well if he is going to put a horseshoe in his glove to cheat at this fight,so am I!He is not going to step all over me!See?Thats one reason.Not a good reason,but one of the reasons.
2.Another not so obvious reason is that some players either knowing they are playing a cheater or unknowingly or if they are playing a very strong opponent,say 2200+ and they are for example 1900.....want to "test" their chess program to see if they are a "better" programmer than the other cheater.I know of one cheater who told me,he knows the top dog on one of the chess sites is a cheater(I won't say where)and he go's about letting his program run for a minimum of one hour think time for each move out of book.He says,no way is "his"program going to beat mine with his quad processor and deep Rybka!See?Its a war of programs alot of times that has players ego all twisted up.
Its unfortunate,but thats how it goes.

Originally posted by Vanquish
I will not read all the posts here,but some not so obvious reasons why some players cheat are as follows:
1.Some sites DO have more cheaters than others and without mentioning which ones,some players say to themselves,well if he is going to put a horseshoe in his glove to cheat at this fight,so am I!He is not going to step all over me!See?Thats one reason. ...[text shortened]... ot of times that has players ego all twisted up.
Its unfortunate,but thats how it goes.

And to quote Homer J Simpson "Mmmmmm, floor doughnut!?"

Originally posted by Vanquish
I will not read all the posts here,but some not so obvious reasons why some players cheat are as follows:
1.Some sites DO have more cheaters than others and without mentioning which ones,some players say to themselves,well if he is going to put a horseshoe in his glove to cheat at this fight,so am I!He is not going to step all over me!See?Thats one reason. ...[text shortened]... ot of times that has players ego all twisted up.
Its unfortunate,but thats how it goes.

That's too bad that people think they should cheat because they think another player is cheating. I came to this chess site and had 2 games against a player who was also new. I beat up on the player pretty well in both games.

Some time later I saw that player had become rated 2000+ shortly after our games. Did they think I WAS CHEATING so they decided they would?

I started rated near high 1300, now trying to get near 1500. A low rated player very well may have thought I was cheating... but I wasn't.

P-

Originally posted by Phlabibit
That's too bad that people think they should cheat because they think another player is cheating. I came to this chess site and had 2 games against a player who was also new. I beat up on the player pretty well in both games.

Some time later I saw that player had become rated 2000+ shortly after our games. Did they think I WAS CHEATING so they decide ...[text shortened]... ar 1500. A low rated player very well may have thought I was cheating... but I wasn't.

P-

I never thought you were cheating when we played soon after I joined this site but I always thought you were watching me carefully to see if I was In fact I thought I'd been set up but was not concerned because I knew I was kosher.

Originally posted by Dragon Fire
I never thought you were cheating when we played soon after I joined this site but I always thought you were watching me carefully to see if I was In fact I thought I'd been set up but was not concerned because I knew I was kosher.

Ug!

Game 2194847

Leave my queen alone!

P-

Originally posted by Phlabibit
Ug!

Game 2194847

Leave my queen alone!

P-

Looks like we were in book until about move 17 then you found a stunning innovation!

Originally posted by Dragon Fire
Looks like we were in book until about move 17 then you found a stunning innovation!

i know 1100 that play better than that.

Originally posted by Dragon Fire
Looks like we were in book until about move 17 then you found a stunning innovation!

Only a car engine could find such a move!

on 17. Isn't black forced to play gxB? Then you try and castle Queen side? Castling will be very difficult.

Although at this point, I think black is in trouble !

Originally posted by Very Rusty
on 17. Isn't black forced to play gxB? Then you try and castle Queen side? Castling will be very difficult.

Although at this point, I think black is in trouble !

you probably shouldn't castle at all at that point, it just wastes tempi and doesn't really make black king any more safe. it probably won't even be possible with those guns on c&d-files. I see two choices: 1) try to exchange pieces to stiffle white's attack, which will probably fail, and 2) Rf8, f5, then throw all you've got against the white king.

ha, fritz wants to castle kingside after ...gxf6 Bd5 🙂 it looks insane. maybe it found a way to exchange some pieces off, but I doubt a human would go there?

There’s no easy answer to preventing cheating. However, I wonder if in conjuction with other methods, getting players to annotate some of their games may help?

For example, if someone creates no suspicion, there is no requirement for them to annotate any games. But as the suspicion increases, so does the requirement to annotate. Optionally, these annotations could be made public and other players could input a “I’m convinced or not” value against it.

I believe that many cheaters won’t be able to annotate their games adequately. The requirement to do so may be a deterrent.

Of course, there are cases where an engine can suggest a move that I didn't think of, but once shown I understand why it is good. Annotations wouldn't help here, but it still means the cheater can't just copy all engines moves, especially cheaters who are weak players.

Originally posted by Varenka
There’s no easy answer to preventing cheating. However, I wonder if in conjuction with other methods, getting players to annotate some of their games may help?

For example, if someone creates no suspicion, there is no requirement for them to annotate any games. But as the suspicion increases, so does the requirement to annotate. Optionally, these annot ...[text shortened]... eans the cheater can't just copy all engines moves, especially cheaters who are weak players.

I agree annotations can sort out the men from the boys. Cheaters will just rattle of variations whereas genuine players will give reasons and variations at the key decision points that explain their reasoning. These key points are not always the points where an engine would identify the greatest shift in balance.

... but, and this is a very big but, many perfectly legitimate players may simply find giving annotations difficult so whereas good annotations may help indicate innosence the inability to annotate does not indicate guilt.

Originally posted by Varenka
There’s no easy answer to preventing cheating. However, I wonder if in conjuction with other methods, getting players to annotate some of their games may help?

For example, if someone creates no suspicion, there is no requirement for them to annotate any games. But as the suspicion increases, so does the requirement to annotate. Optionally, these annot ...[text shortened]... eans the cheater can't just copy all engines moves, especially cheaters who are weak players.

I'm 100% certain I'm playing an engine in one of my tournaments at the moment.
His graph just says it all; a fluctuating 1200-1250 a year a go & voilà now 2000+!

My tactic will be to drag the games out as long as possible, hoping he gets banned eventually, as he is playing some heavy-hitters who may well lose, analyse & provide evidence. Let's just hope someone does something about it!

Originally posted by Dragon Fire
many perfectly legitimate players may simply find giving annotations difficult

To some extent, I agree with this. But I wonder how common such issues would be?! I've never been involved in an OTB post mortem where my opponent frequently found it hard to explain their moves.

Also, on a global web site, can we support annotations in every possible language...