21 Dec '12 23:20>
I was listening to a Magnus interview in which he stated that there are many people who know a lot about chess but cannot seem to improve, why is that the case?
Originally posted by ThabtosHi Thabtos, I think you are correct but it struck me as i was doing some puzzles that it essentially comes down to the decision making process and how on earth one even goes about improving that process. For example, its relatively easy to go through ones own games and find mistakes, tactical ones especially, because they stick out. So what is the solution? to practice more tactics, to try to avoid sharp positions in the first place or to try to understand why one got into a tactically suspect position at all? I have played literally thousands of tactical puzzles yet my rating at doing tactics stay roughly the same about 1600- 1700 and I have concluded that I suck at tactics and simply have no hope of improving, my solution is therefore to try to avoid sharp positions and I will never get better at tactics no matter how many I do, therefore I need to try to compensate for it in some other ways and it comes down to accentuating strengths rather than concentrating on weaknesses. I really think that if anyone wants to improve a mentor is a must, its simply not possible to be completely objective, at least not for me.
I think the obvious answer is that the key to improvement is not knowing a lot about chess, but being driven to know more about your own strengths and weaknesses. Sometimes people don't have the fire in their belly to continue to improve and they don't want to get better.
You can spend 3 hours a day studying master games, and you'll know a lot about chess ...[text shortened]... bility isn't going to improve as much, even though you've memorized a ton of master games.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYou have to study tactics like you would any other facet of the game, not just do puzzle after puzzle. Did you do even close to the amount of positional puzzles as you did tactics puzzles? No? Then what did you do to get better at understanding the positional aspect?
Hi Thabtos, I think you are correct but it struck me as i was doing some puzzles that it essentially comes down to the decision making process and how on earth one even goes about improving that process. For example, its relatively easy to go through ones own games and find mistakes, tactical ones especially, because they stick out. So what is the ...[text shortened]... ove a mentor is a must, its simply not possible to be completely objective, at least not for me.
Originally posted by tomtom232the only thing that i found that helped me solve tactical puzzles was to try to identify
You have to study tactics like you would any other facet of the game, not just do puzzle after puzzle. Did you do even close to the amount of positional puzzles as you did tactics puzzles? No? Then what did you do to get better at understanding the positional aspect?
Bring that same approacch to tactis.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieNo I do a few things. For example, I have a pretty slim opening rep and when I go over my games looking for missed tactics I save the game and the position where I missed the tactic. When I do tactics on, say, chesstempo I look to see if the first move was actually the critical move and then I go over the whole game. If I missed it I put in a database based on certain patterns and whichever database fills up the quickest is the one I put the most effort into studying. If you want quicker results just organize tactics by opening and only do this for the opening/s you use.
the only thing that i found that helped me solve tactical puzzles was to try to identify
what type of puzzle it was, solve for mate, win material, pawn promotion, exploitation
of a pin, clearance sacrifice, removal of the defender etc, once I had identified the
tactic it somehow became easier to solve, but i still cannot progress beyond 1800s
tactically no matter how many i do. How do you study tactics, surely you just do
them?
Originally posted by tomtom232the best thing would be to give it up, its simply futility endeavouring to make progress
No I do a few things. For example, I have a pretty slim opening rep and when I go over my games looking for missed tactics I save the game and the position where I missed the tactic. When I do tactics on, say, chesstempo I look to see if the first move was actually the critical move and then I go over the whole game. If I missed it I put in a database base ybe this is your chess hump? In order to get better at chess you need to get more organized.
Originally posted by RJHindsNo i don't think psychology is helping, good moves help and trying to ascertain the
Psychology.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI make progress if my chesstempo rating steadily going up is considered progress. Truth is, I don't put in much effort these days and when I did put in the most effort I hadn't really thought about the most efficient way to learn. Successful people in life tend to be successful in chess... It is our own fault we don't improve. If we did the neccesary tasks to improve we would.
the best thing would be to give it up, its simply futility endeavouring to make progress
when there is no real way of doing so.
Originally posted by tomtom232well that's fine and good but I don't think its as easy as a formula as put in more effort
I make progress if my chesstempo rating steadily going up is considered progress. Truth is, I don't put in much effort these days and when I did put in the most effort I hadn't really thought about the most efficient way to learn. Successful people in life tend to be successful in chess... It is our own fault we don't improve. If we did the neccesary tasks to improve we would.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYes, and the teachers and coaches give them a structured, efficient method of learning. My point wasn't max effort = max skill, my point was that the way we learn is important. Putting no thought on the proper way to study... It doesn't matter how much effort you put in if you are not willing to follow a well thought out study plan.
well that's fine and good but I don't think its as easy as a formula as put in more effort
and you will improve, everyone reaches a kind of zenith of their ability, this is my point
Tomo, where improvement is simply not possible no matter how much effort we put
into it, is it not the case? I suspect humility is the ability to recognise our lim ...[text shortened]... no help like self help but still, even the greatest have teachers and coaches, do
they not?
Originally posted by tomtom232Ok i see, following some kind of study plan. Yes I admit the concept is alien to me, I
Yes, and the teachers and coaches give them a structure efficient method of learning. My point wasn't max effort = max skill, my point was that the way we learn is important. Putting no thought in the proper way to study... It doesn't matter how much effort you put in if you are willing to follow a well thought out study plan.
Originally posted by tomtom232can you suggest a study plan Tomo, like a simple one, 30 mins tactics, 30 mins on
Yes, and the teachers and coaches give them a structured, efficient method of learning. My point wasn't max effort = max skill, my point was that the way we learn is important. Putting no thought on the proper way to study... It doesn't matter how much effort you put in if you are not willing to follow a well thought out study plan.
My personal plan is ...[text shortened]... have to bring mashed potatoes to the pot luck does knowing how to fry them do you any good?