TOURNAMENT RESTRUCTURE IDEA

Hi RUSS 🙂

I posted this in another thread but i think i might have stumbled on an idea.....

I don't understand what happened. We used to get about 3 a week. Now the only available tournie's have group sizes that are huge!!! When i entered the 2005 championship, i got soooo many games, i had to resign them all! It just wasn't any fun, i don't come here to play blitz.

I'd rather see a more structured range of tournaments. One HUGE tournament a month, with a banded series of tournaments a week, with 1 normal all comers tournie a week as well.

If the time controls of these tournaments rotated over the month it would provide players with a rich choice of tournaments over a month to suit even the pickiest pawn star, ie...

month=4 weeks

week1
-Huge tournament-Group size=8 Open to new entrants for a whole month!
-Banded Tournaments (4 bands)- Group size=4 open for a week! 1 day 7 days TO.
-Regular 'all comers' Tournament- Group size=4 open for a week! 1 day 7days TO.

week2
-Banded Tournaments (4 bands)- Group size=4 open for a week! 3 day 7 days TO.
-Regular 'all comers' Tournament- Group size=4 open for a week! 3 day 7days TO.

week3
-Banded Tournaments (4 bands)- Group size=4 open for a week! 7 day 14 days TO.
-Regular 'all comers' Tournament- Group size=4 open for a week! 7 day 14days TO.

etc.... for 4 weeks, were upon the cycle repeats. The forth week would rotate between 14/14 and 21/28 tournaments as they are generally less popular and take ages to fill up anyway.

I'm sure i'm not the only player who is put off from playing tournaments because the time controls are too short, or too long......or because the group sizes are too big or small....

Personally i have a set criteria for which tournaments i enter. I don't like 3 day timeouts, yet all the tournaments are 3 day, consequently i don't play in many.

If there was a structure to when the tournaments started, then players could plan which and when they join. I would plan to join one a month, and know that i was going to get the one i want!!

I'm sure the reason the tournaments are restricted is because of performance issues on the servers, so adding tournaments might look like an un necissary burden. However, i believe that should this system be implemented, players will firstly play in less tournaments rather than more, as they will be waiting for the one's with their prefered time control and group size. I, along with most players i feel, have a game limit which i stick to. If i enter a tournament, i play less clan and casual games as a result.

being regular and predictable like clockwork is great if you are exactly perfect with your method.

but:

tournament creation has many, many varieties, and what suits you will not suit others.
russ needs to bend with the flow and gradually find the optimal.

once the optimal is found: then i agree, regularity is nice.

i am not a fan of your tournament time control suggestions:
the faster tournaments will suffer massive timeouts, and the slower ones may take many years to finish even one round.
i think short timeout with very long timebank is the essence ... if you cannot play 1/28, 2/28 and 3/28 then can you play 4/28 or 5/28? they will give a much faster tournament than 7/14.

Originally posted by flexmore
being regular and predictable like clockwork is great if you are exactly perfect with your method.

but:

tournament creation has many, many varieties, and what suits you will not suit others.
russ needs to bend with the flow and gradually find the optimal.

once the optimal is found: then i agree, regularity is nice.

i am not a fan of your tourna ...[text shortened]... /28 and 3/28 then can you play 4/28 or 5/28? they will give a much faster tournament than 7/14.

I'm perfectly willing to accept that my structure is not perfect. I'm not that attached to it, i just wanted to make the point hat, if they were structured, more people would take the time to play in them. AS it is, MAP players (and top 50) play in all the tournie's. If there was a cycle, average players who shy about starting a million games at once, get a chance to experience the joy of competition.

Originally posted by marinakatomb
Hi RUSS 🙂

I posted this in another thread but i think i might have stumbled on an idea.....

I don't understand what happened. We used to get about 3 a week. Now the only available tournie's have group sizes that are huge!!! When i entered the 2005 championship, i got soooo many games, i had to resign them all! It just wasn't any fun, i don ...[text shortened]... t which i stick to. If i enter a tournament, i play less clan and casual games as a result.

come on ppl, rec marinkatomb's post, this would be so much better

Originally posted by Ouermyhte
come on ppl, rec marinkatomb's post, this would be so much better

Thank you, you have no idea how much i appretiate that 😀

Just a guess here, but one of the things that holds Russ back is time constraints due to his busy lifestyle.

I guess that he needs to automate the process a bit more.

There are definately elements which cannot be automated, such as when to start a tourney that has no realistic max player limit. eg 2005 tourney.

So what would happen if you let the player community control the creation and starting of tournaments within a structure similar to how marinakatomb has described.

Russ could set up a page of template tourneys. Clan leaders (or otherwise responsible subscribers) then join a que to essentially run a tourney from a list of choices available at the time of the month that the tourney is flagged to start. The tourney could be flagged as being run by the particular clan similar to sponsored tourneys. The clan leader decides the exact dimensions of the tourney.

Of course Russ could always create other tourneys if the structured one's don't cover all the tourneys that users are demanding. BUT at least it would cover a majority of them and save Russ time to work on extra development long term.

There are probably a few issues with this but I think they can be handled. In fact, I only really thought of this as I was typing in the fact that Russ has time constraints so I really haven't thought it through.

Some issues:

AWOL: what happens when six months later, the clan leader has left RHP or otherwise goes awol? Russ might have to take over in those cases.

Independant: Quite simply, the way groups are determined needs to be automatic calculated. The organiser cannot decide who plays who. Indeed, it is probably important that at the least, the clan leader cannot enter the tourney.

Originally posted by Hegemon
Just a guess here, but one of the things that holds Russ back is time constraints due to his busy lifestyle.

I guess that he needs to automate the process a bit more.

There are definately elements which cannot be automated, such as wh ...[text shortened]... ant that at the least, the clan leader cannot enter the tourney.

it would be fun making the new tournaments.
i would certainly be happy to forego the ability to play in tournaments, just to be able to structure them 🙂
i would take time and care and regularly maintain them and listen to suggestions.

but russ has not spoken ... oh great god speak to us!

Originally posted by Hegemon
Just a guess here, but one of the things that holds Russ back is time constraints due to his busy lifestyle.

I guess that he needs to automate the process a bit more.

There are definately elements which cannot be automated, such as when to start a tourney that has no realistic max player limit. eg 2005 tourney.

So what would happen if you let the pl ...[text shortened]... Indeed, it is probably important that at the least, the clan leader cannot enter the tourney.

This is a nice idea, though i don't think Russ will be too keen on it. The tournaments should be automated. If there was a weekly/monthly/yearly cycle, then a simple script could manage it, thus meaning (bar code malfunction) he can wash his hands of it.

We could in fact have our own champions league!! Winners of each months section (be it the Huge monthly tournie, or the 1000-1199 banded 1/7 tournie) automatically advance to a winners tournament at the end of the year! You would then have an annual champion in a specific Time and rating section. That would be cool!!!! That would be more than cool, it would be chesstastic!!!

The tournaments could be named thus

January

Week1
-January Huge
-January Banded 1/7 (4 bands)
-January all comers 1/7

Week 2
-January Banded 3/7
-January all comers 3/7

etc.....

At the end of the year that would leave 12 winners of say, the all comers 1/7. Those people go into a 12 player all play all CHAMPIONS TOURNAMENT!!!!!

Groovy? Not groovy?? ......perhaps just funky????

Originally posted by marinakatomb
This is a nice idea, though i don't think Russ will be too keen on it. The tournaments should be automated. If there was a weekly/monthly/yearly cycle, then a simple script could manage it, thus meaning (bar code malfunction) he can wash his hands of it.

We could in fact have our own champions league!! Winners of each months section (be it the Huge ...[text shortened]... ayer all play all CHAMPIONS TOURNAMENT!!!!!

Groovy? Not groovy?? ......perhaps just funky????

And what if say one of those tournaments takes much longer than it should. Say the December tournament doesn't finish until mid next year (could happen with multiple rounds with some long finishing games). Then you start the champions tourney and that may take 2 months. In the end you are crowning this years winner near the end of next year.

The problem gets worse as the timeout/timebanks get longer.

Originally posted by XanthosNZ
And what if say one of those tournaments takes much longer than it should. Say the December tournament doesn't finish until mid next year (could happen with multiple rounds with some long finishing games). Then you start the champions tourney and that may take 2 months. In the end you are crowning this years winner near the end of next year.

The problem gets worse as the timeout/timebanks get longer.

I realize this. It's not perfect but there isn't any way i can think of to remedy this. I just thought it would be really cool to have a champions league!!


Look, when ever i write it i have to follow it with more than one punctuation mark, it has to be a good idea!!!!!

I'd like to see more regular "duel" style tournies too.

Originally posted by Exy
I'd like to see more regular "duel" style tournies too.

I see no reason why the 4th week couldn't be a bonanza week. All of the main tournaments are covered in weeks 1-3. Week four could have a random mixture of requested tournaments. Duals, Clan sponsored, all play alls, etc...

A little automation might be a great addition to the tournaments.
I love the tournies and I'm really trying my utmost to win one - I want the accolades in my profile!
A structured routine approach like that could be great.

The idea of subscribers having some control over tournies also has merit.
The same way mods handle some admin in the forums could probably be applied to tournies as well - we could have a 'director' for every tourney...
If there were tournament 'templates' as was mentioned earlier, a volunteer administrator section could easily be created.

This could also free up lots of time for Russ to apply himself to the job he does best - programming.

how about:
every entrant to a tournament inputs their preferred timeout, and timebank and group size.
they could also vote for "original" or "random" groupings.

the median value for each is chosen.

(median: The middle value in a distribution, above and below which lie an equal number of values.)

if only russ had the time .. it would be interesting as a tournament every week.

Originally posted by marinakatomb

When i entered the 2005 championship, i got soooo many games, i had to resign them all! It just wasn't any fun, i don't come here to play blitz.

But when you entered the 2005 championship the potential group sizes were already known. Also, there was no need to resign these games, a 60 day timebank is plenty. Not many blitz games last 120 days!

As for the rest of your suggestions, I'm not such a lover of regularity. Its nice to bring up the tournament page and find something different and exotic.

I suppose the basic rule of thumb is to cater for demand. I think there is a huge body of players in 1200-1700 range scrambling to enter far for too few banded tournaments of popular time length.