Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeAye, and there's the rub...
Oh great, not only do we have absolute facts and brute facts, we now have bona fide facts crashing the party.
You're a brute sir, and that's a fact.
(You might want to edit out your last sentence though. 'Faith' is only believed, not known, so by your own reasoning can't be factual or true).
Atheists will never admit a belief in evolution has anything to do with faith. When I was an atheist I was thoroughly convinced evolution was a fact, and that's a fact. But I have an almost allergic reaction to peer pressure tactics used to subdue independent thinking.
I'm exaggerating when I say "allergic reaction", but it does accurately represent how I feel about hypocrites and liars.
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Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeIf truth is not absolute how can anything be a fact? Or do facts change? And if you can't be absolutely sure about anything then all belief requires a measure of faith. It's just a question of where you put it.
Oh great, not only do we have absolute facts and brute facts, we now have bona fide facts crashing the party.
You're a brute sir, and that's a fact.
(You might want to edit out your last sentence though. 'Faith' is only believed, not known, so by your own reasoning can't be factual or true).
Originally posted by lemon limeWho's an atheist?
Aye, and there's the rub...
Atheists will never admit a belief in evolution has anything to do with faith. When I was an atheist I was thoroughly convinced evolution was a fact, and that's a fact. But I have an almost allergic reaction to peer pressure tactics used to subdue independent thinking.
I'm exaggerating when I say "allergic reaction", but it does accurately represent how I feel about hypocrites and liars.
I'm a temporary Jainist sir. Didn't you get the memo?
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkAs explained (more than once) the only truth available to man is not absolute, as what may be truth in this universe may not be truth in another. Talk of 'absolute anything' is therefore a nonsense reserved only for theists and men who howl at the moon.
If truth is not absolute how can anything be a fact? Or do facts change? And if you can't be absolutely sure about anything then all belief requires a measure of faith. It's just a question of where you put it.
Beliefs demand evidence, they don't require faith.
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Originally posted by FetchmyjunkNo, that is not true and it is false. That is why I earlier pointed out your failure to take note of the quotation marks and emphasis.
Something that is not "not true" is "false".
Are clouds true? If not, are they false?
You could say it is "neither true nor false".
Surely that would be saying it is not true? It seems you are confused. The word 'neither' means 'the following are both 'not'.
One word cannot have two contradictory meanings.
On that, you are wrong:
http://www.dailywritingtips.com/75-contronyms-words-with-contradictory-meanings/
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeBut what is true in my universe is still true in my universe. I am not worried about other universes.
As explained (more than once) the only truth available to man is not absolute, as what may be truth in this universe may not be truth in another. Talk of 'absolute anything' is therefore a nonsense reserved only for theists and men who howl at the moon.
Beliefs demand evidence, they don't require faith.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkMy dear fellow have you suffered a concussion? Have you been struck senseless by a mischievously thrown cauliflower?
But what is true in my universe is still true in my universe. I am not worried about other universes.
If truth is only true in your universe, and not others, how can it be absolute?
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Originally posted by twhiteheadIf your answer to a question is "not true" that means it is "false". Something that is 'neither true nor false' is not 'false' neither is it 'true'.
No, that is not true and it is false. That is why I earlier pointed out your failure to take note of the quotation marks and emphasis.
Are clouds true? If not, are they false?
[b]You could say it is "neither true nor false".
Surely that would be saying it is not true? It seems you are confused. The word 'neither' means 'the following are both 'no ...[text shortened]... you are wrong:
http://www.dailywritingtips.com/75-contronyms-words-with-contradictory-meanings/[/b]
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeIf you can't be absolutely sure about anything how can you be absolutely sure that there is more than 1 universe? And how can you be absolutely sure than you can't be absolutely sure about anything?
My dear fellow have you suffered a concussion? Have you been struck senseless by a mischievously thrown cauliflower?
If truth is only true in your universe, and not others, how can it be absolute?
Originally posted by sonshipThanks, you are spot on, my bad.
Fetch, an old riddle I have used pertains to a word which means what it means and also the opposite. Its the word [b]cleave, I think.
Two things can cleave together.
Two things you can cleave apart.
I think.
Anyway, it has made a good brain teaser of a riddle for some years.[/b]
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Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeWhile the arrogance of modern man looks down on faith as a poor step child, it can be hardly questioned that the arguably most powerful personality in history spoke much about faith.
As explained (more than once) the only truth available to man is not absolute, as what may be truth in this universe may not be truth in another. Talk of 'absolute anything' is therefore a nonsense reserved only for theists and men who howl at the moon.
Beliefs demand evidence, they don't require faith.
That would be Jesus of Nazareth.
IE. He asks His disciples if when He comes in His second coming will He find faith on the earth.
" Nevertheless, when the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth ?" (Luke 18:8b)
Jesus lived on and by faith. It was an ingredient of the huge impact He has on human history.
Originally posted by FetchmyjunkNo it doesn't. That is a false dichotomy. 🙂
If your answer to a question is "not true" that means it is "false".
Something that is 'neither true nor false' is not 'false' neither is it 'true'.
Therefore if the answer to a question is neither true nor false, it is not true - contradicting your first sentence.
