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Absolute truth

Absolute truth

Spirituality

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Ah, I see from Wikipedia that Murdoch is a Platonist. I have never been attracted to Platonic metaphysical "idealism".

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Originally posted by finnegan
So if I asked you whether you were born a male or female you wouldn't be able to answer me? And you wouldn't be absolutely sure of your answer?


If you imagine that this question allows for an absolute answer then you are just not paying attention to the world around you. You absoutely fail to understand that what is "absolute" in your mi ...[text shortened]... ay not remain quite so clear in your own mind depending on your experiences in the future.

I notice that you did not answer my question. I asked you whether YOU were not absolutely sure what YOUR gender was. Then you recite a gay poem? So Sir/Madam what do you think the poem proves?

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Originally posted by finnegan
Spitting out your dummy?

You put forward as an example of absolute truth the claim that everyone knows for certain if they are male or female. It was your example and it is demonstrably not absolutely true. You appear unhappy to have this pointed out to you and unable to refute my challenge.

Your various examples do not make your case any more rea ...[text shortened]... one - but I see no good reason to imagine that you are the go-to person if we want to find them.
No, Sir/Madam I asked you a question and instead of answering it you quote a poem. How exactly does your poem prove that you aren't sure what your gender is? And that that no one else can be sure what their gender is?


Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
You seem distracted by 'absolutes' that you believe you have absolute certainty of. (You have two feet, your nose is on your face etc). The real discussion is about bigger issues that you can't possibly speak of in absolute terms.

In regards to God for example, the best you can say is that for you he absolutely exists, but that is meaningless in w ...[text shortened]... ts or not, as is merely confined within your own personal and unavoidably limited understanding.
A minute ago you said you believed there were no absolute truths? Have you changed your mind? This is the real discussion. Are you you not absolutely sure that your nose is on your face?


Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
A minute ago you said you believed there were no absolute truths? Have you changed your mind? This is the real discussion. Are you you not absolutely sure that your nose is on your face?
There is no change of mind. I said 'you seem distracted by 'absolutes' that you believe you have absolute certainty of.' (You, not me). Why are you afraid to discuss those 'absolutes' that are beyond the visible? Is it because those 'absolutes' are based on conjecture rather than verifiable evidence?

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Originally posted by vistesd
Ah, I see from Wikipedia that Murdoch is a Platonist. I have never been attracted to Platonic metaphysical "idealism".
Of a truth it is unattractive! 😉

Thought about you the other day and lo there you are!

I pray you and yours are well.


Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
There is no change of mind. I said 'you seem distracted by 'absolutes' that you believe you have absolute certainty of.' (You, not me). Why are you afraid to discuss those 'absolutes' that are beyond the visible? Is it because those 'absolutes' are based on conjecture rather than verifiable evidence?
But what verifiable evidence do you have that proves there is no verifiable evidence for absolutes beyond the visible?

Oh, I see, you want me to go first! 😉

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Originally posted by josephw
But what verifiable evidence do you have that proves there is no verifiable evidence for absolutes beyond the visible?

Oh, I see, you want me to go first! 😉
If you wouldn't mind.

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The post that was quoted here has been removed
You know as well as I do that I was talking about Fin being absolutely certain about his current gender. Since he isn't I shall be addressing him/her as Sir/Madam.

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Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
There is no change of mind. I said 'you seem distracted by 'absolutes' that you believe you have absolute certainty of.' (You, not me). Why are you afraid to discuss those 'absolutes' that are beyond the visible? Is it because those 'absolutes' are based on conjecture rather than verifiable evidence?
So are you saying you don't have absolute certainty that your nose is on your face? If you can't even be absolutely certain of your own existence then I am wasting my time trying to converse with you, because if your own existence is not enough verifiable evidence to convince you with absolute certainty that you do in fact exist, then nothing will ever convince you of the supernatural.

How can you be absolutely certain that you are in fact an atheist? Oh wait, you can't.

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Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So are you saying you don't have absolute certainty that your nose is on your face? If you can't even be absolutely certain of your own existence then I am wasting my time trying to converse with you, because if your own existence is not enough verifiable evidence to convince you with absolute certainty that you do in fact exist, then nothing will ever c ...[text shortened]... tural.

How can you be absolutely certain that you are in fact an atheist? Oh wait, you can't.
If he says he is an atheist and fully knows the definition of atheist, then he is an atheist. That IS an absolute.


Originally posted by sonhouse
If he says he is an atheist and fully knows the definition of atheist, then he is an atheist. That IS an absolute.
Close, but no cigar. It's an absolute certainty that he has said he is an atheist. But whether he is or not is not something that can be proven beyond him simply uttering words to the effect that he is. Atheists constantly challenge assertions made by Christians about God and demand physical proof, so turn about is fair play... where is physical proof demonstrating his belief (in no god or gods) to be absolute?

Saying so is not confirmation or proof of a supposed fact. This would be like a scientist confirming the reality of a hypothesis (in spite of evidence to the contrary) by simply stating it is a fact.

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Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
You know as well as I do that I was talking about Fin being absolutely certain about his current gender. Since he isn't I shall be addressing him/her as Sir/Madam.
As I recall, you asked not me but Ghost of a Duke a number of questions which appeared to me to be based on a confident belief that he would have no choice but to give an absolutely confident and unambiguous answer. While all were deficient for your purpose (you really are barking up the wrong tree and failing to gasp the issues properly) I was especially struck by your absurd confidence that a question about sexuality could only admit a binary choice. The point of the poem was to remind you that sexuality is not a binary male / female choice.

If you wish to refer to me as Sir / Madam then please do. It reveals more about you than about me. I am not so insecure about my sexuality that I am frightened of being mislabelled. Perhaps you have some anxiety around this topic.