1. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    13 Aug '15 14:08
    atheism is a belief Thread 154278 (33 Pages)
    Original post by apathist [on 13 Jul '13 14:01.Last moved 614 days 14 hours and 38 minutes ago]

    "There are those who believe that atheism is best defined as a lack of belief in gods. Well, babies and rocks don't believe in gods.

    By using dictionaries and encyclopedias, it turns out that atheism requires belief.

    I'm pretty sure than must be correct, unless you have scientific evidence that gods cannot exist? :/"
    _______________________________________

    Your opinions, speculations and/or latest insights pro or con?
  2. Joined
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    13 Aug '15 14:11
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]atheism is a belief Thread 154278 (33 Pages)
    Original post by apathist [on 13 Jul '13 14:01.Last moved 614 days 14 hours and 38 minutes ago]

    "There are those who believe that atheism is best defined as a lack of belief in gods. Well, babies and rocks don't believe in gods.

    By using dictionaries and encyclopedias, it t ...[text shortened]... ______________________________

    Your opinions, speculations and/or latest insights pro or con?[/b]
    Define "belief"?
  3. SubscriberFMF
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    13 Aug '15 14:13
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    Your opinions, speculations and/or latest insights pro or con?
    Do you think atheism is a belief?
  4. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    13 Aug '15 14:42
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]atheism is a belief Thread 154278 (33 Pages)
    Original post by apathist [on 13 Jul '13 14:01.Last moved 614 days 14 hours and 38 minutes ago]

    "There are those who believe that atheism is best defined as a lack of belief in gods. Well, babies and rocks don't believe in gods.

    By using dictionaries and encyclopedias, it t ...[text shortened]... ______________________________

    Your opinions, speculations and/or latest insights pro or con?[/b]
    I think many Christians 'want' atheism to be understood as a belief system, to establish a 'defensive equilibrium.' This way when an atheist rejects God or challenges a Christian about their faith they can simply say, 'well it's just a question of belief. We have our believe system and you have yours.'

    But atheists really are just like rocks when it comes to God. Belief doesn't come into it. We are unified by nothing other than an absence of God in our lives and thinking. - And this doesn't mean that we rush out to fill the void left by God. We simply do not think there is a void to fill.(But as atheists can not really be unified, i can't claim to speak for all atheists on this).

    I think you would have been better off GB in stating clearly that you think atheism is a belief, rather than quoting a post from antiquity. There is strength in directness.
  5. Standard memberavalanchethecat
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    13 Aug '15 15:27
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]atheism is a belief Thread 154278 (33 Pages)
    Original post by apathist [on 13 Jul '13 14:01.Last moved 614 days 14 hours and 38 minutes ago]

    "There are those who believe that atheism is best defined as a lack of belief in gods. Well, babies and rocks don't believe in gods.

    By using dictionaries and encyclopedias, it t ...[text shortened]... ______________________________

    Your opinions, speculations and/or latest insights pro or con?[/b]
    What do you imagine the atheist believes? That there isn't a god? I don't believe that. I just don't believe there is one. I accept that I could be wrong. Do you accept that you could be wrong in your belief that there is one?
  6. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    13 Aug '15 16:231 edit
    Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
    I think many Christians 'want' atheism to be understood as a belief system, to establish a 'defensive equilibrium.' This way when an atheist rejects God or challenges a Christian about their faith they can simply say, 'well it's just a question of belief. We have our believe system and you have yours.'

    But atheists really are just like rocks when it ...[text shortened]... ink atheism is a belief, rather than quoting a post from antiquity. There is strength in directness.
    Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
    "I think you would have been better off GB in stating clearly that you think atheism is a belief,..."

    Please be patient, GD, apathist's thread is only a few hours old. GB will deliver to all focused on topic questions such as yours [as opposed to subjective personality focused questions] in due time. As an employee once said to me: "Mr. Bob, please don't push me; I'll work cheaper". True. lol.

    P.S. I appreciate your first two words which speak volumes about you and your intellectual maturity: "I think" Thanks for being here.
  7. Cape Town
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    13 Aug '15 17:00
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    By using dictionaries and encyclopedias, it turns out that atheism requires belief.
    You should have started with the biggest and best encyclopaedia in the world:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism

    It turns out that atheism does not require belief.
  8. Cape Town
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    13 Aug '15 17:04
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    GB will deliver to all focused on topic questions such as yours [as opposed to subjective personality focused questions] in due time.
    I have noticed a trend in your threads where you respond to most of the questions with demand for patience and promises that all will be revealed in due time, but it never is. I think you are just avoiding answering the question. (yes, I know this is a subjective off topic personality focused comment and not a question at all - but it is still probably true).
  9. SubscriberBigDoggProblem
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    13 Aug '15 17:12
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]atheism is a belief Thread 154278 (33 Pages)
    Original post by apathist [on 13 Jul '13 14:01.Last moved 614 days 14 hours and 38 minutes ago]

    "There are those who believe that atheism is best defined as a lack of belief in gods. Well, babies and rocks don't believe in gods.

    By using dictionaries and encyclopedias, it t ...[text shortened]... ______________________________

    Your opinions, speculations and/or latest insights pro or con?[/b]
    Let G = "One or more gods exist".

    Some atheists say there is insufficient evidence for G. That sort of atheism is best described as a lack of belief.

    Some atheists say G is false. That sort of atheism can be described as a belief in not-G.
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    13 Aug '15 17:372 edits
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
    "I think you would have been better off GB in stating clearly that you think atheism is a belief,..."

    Please be patient, GD, apathist's thread is only a few hours old. GB will deliver to all focused on topic questions such as yours [as opposed to subjective personality focused questions] in due time. As a ...[text shortened]... s which speak volumes about you and your intellectual maturity: "I think" Thanks for being here.
    Why post a link to another posters thread? Why can't you just state up front what YOUR point of view is and why?

    One of the reasons you and a few other people get stick here is your reluctance to commit on a particular issue and a reluctance to answer direct on topic questions as you are doing here.
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    13 Aug '15 17:39
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    I have noticed a trend in your threads where you respond to most of the questions with demand for patience and promises that all will be revealed in due time, but it never is. I think you are just avoiding answering the question. (yes, I know this is a subjective off topic personality focused comment and not a question at all - but it is still probably true).
    I think are totally spot on. Lemon Lime is another, jospehw another.
  12. Hmmm . . .
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    13 Aug '15 19:261 edit
    Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
    Let G = "One or more gods exist".

    Some atheists say there is insufficient evidence for G. That sort of atheism is best described as a lack of belief.

    Some atheists say G is false. That sort of atheism can be described as a belief in not-G.
    Bingo. (And I do not presently class myself as an atheist--though I suspect that many theists might.)
  13. Cape Town
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    13 Aug '15 19:412 edits
    Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
    Some atheists say G is false. That sort of atheism can be described as a belief in not-G.
    I would describe my own belief on the mater a belief that not-G. Belief in has a very different connotation.

    It must of course be noted, for all the theists with short memories, that they too hold a belief that not-G or belief in not-G for many entities other than the God they do believe in. They also hold a belief that not-fairies, just as I do but would not claim that their afairyism 'requires belief'.
  14. Standard memberKellyJay
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    13 Aug '15 21:15
    Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
    Let G = "One or more gods exist".

    Some atheists say there is insufficient evidence for G. That sort of atheism is best described as a lack of belief.

    Some atheists say G is false. That sort of atheism can be described as a belief in not-G.
    The only way that you get a this lack of belief about God is if there isn't a G in the life that
    an Atheist is in. Once one is presented with the possibility of God, than the variable is
    either a yes or a no, with a no there is a rejection so all of them reject God who are
    confronted with Him. They believe that He isn't real so that belief resides in them.
  15. SubscriberBigDoggProblem
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    13 Aug '15 22:56
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    I would describe my own belief on the mater a belief [b]that not-G. Belief in has a very different connotation.

    It must of course be noted, for all the theists with short memories, that they too hold a belief that not-G or belief in not-G for many entities other than the God they do believe in. They also hold a belief that not-fairies, just as I do but would not claim that their afairyism 'requires belief'.[/b]
    I am fine with either version. I used to make a stink about 'belief in' vs. belief that', but now I am not so afraid of the distinction. When I lift my foot up to take a step, I believe in gravity's ability to bring my foot down, every bit as much as a dualist theist believes in his God. The connotation doesn't frighten me.
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