Biblical Prophesy - Evidence For Xtianity?
06 Mar '05 07:102 editsOne of the pieces of evidence which powerfully supports a scientific hypothesis is whether or not it can allow a person to predict some aspect of the future. For example, the Theory of Evolution predicts that certain kinds of fossils will be found and how organisms will change with time, and gravitational theory predicts how quickly things will accelerate downward if dropped. Some people claim that the Bible has made predictions that came true and that these predictions should be taken as evidence that Christianity is a correct model of reality.
Darfius wrote
For instance, if you'll look in my debate with Pawn, Daniel the prophet successfully predicted the world empires including Alexander the Great a couple of centuries before he was born.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=20450&page=2
Based on his post in the "Debate with Darfius" thread, I believe he is referring to Daniel 2, especially Daniel 31-45. Here is the text of Daniel 31-45, copied from Darfius' post:
Thou, O king, sawest, and behold a great image. This great image, whose brightness was excellent, stood before thee; and the form thereof was terrible. This image's head was of fine gold, his breast and his arms of silver, his belly and his thighs of brass, His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay. Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.
This is the dream; and we will tell the interpretation thereof before the king. Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory. And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold. And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth. And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise. And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay. And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken. And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay. And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever. Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=20172&page=2
Darfius claims Daniel 2 specifically predicted "the Medo-Persian empire...the Grecian empire...Under the leadership of Alexander the Great...[and] the Roman Empire".
Does this prophecy count as a scientific hypothesis which successfully made scientific predictions?
I'll copy-paste Darfius' arguments here:
Bible passage: Daniel 2:32-33
Written: about 530 BC
Fulfilled: Throughout history; to be completed during End Times
In Daniel 2:32-33, there is a passage that symbolically identified the four great kingdoms that would rise up and control much of world, beginning in Daniel's lifetime. The passage uses symbolic imagery:
1. The head of gold, as Daniel explained, refers to the Babylonian empire that ruled much of the world about 2600 years ago.
2. Daniel said that the head-of-gold empire would be followed by an empire symbolized by arms of silver. Christian scholars have often interpreted this to refer to the Medo-Persian empire which later conquered the Babylonian empire. The scholars say that the two arms refer to the two groups - the Medes and the Persians - who comprised the Medo-Persian empire.
3. The third kingdom was symbolized by the statue's belly and thighs of brass. Some scholars believe that this is a reference to the Grecian empire, which conquered the Medo-Persian empire. The symbol of a belly and thighs of brass suggests that the kingdom was to start out as a united empire but end up as a divided empire. Under the leadership of Alexander the Great, the Grecian Empire was a united empire. But after Alexander's death, the empire was divided into four parts and was later reduced to two parts.
4. The fourth symbol - that of iron legs and feet that were part iron and part clay - has often been suggested to be a reference to the Roman Empire, which later conquered the Grecian Empire. The Roman Empire was very powerful, but it was also very diverse, claiming dominion over a wide variety of different nations. That diversity later contributed to the downfall of the empire.
These four kingdoms ruled over much of the world, and each of the four ruled over the land of Israel during times in which a significant number of Jews - and perhaps a majority of Jews - were living in their homeland. Before the collapse of the Roman Empire, Jerusalem was destroyed and hundreds of thousands of Jews were forced into exile. Even today, a majority of Jews still live outside of Israel. Many Christian scholars suggest that the Roman Empire will be revived and will once again seek to control Israel.
Quick aside, the European Union refers to itself as the Revived Roman Empire.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=20172&page=2
Darfius wrote
For instance, if you'll look in my debate with Pawn, Daniel the prophet successfully predicted the world empires including Alexander the Great a couple of centuries before he was born.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=20450&page=2
Based on his post in the "Debate with Darfius" thread, I believe he is referring to Daniel 2, especially Daniel 31-45. Here is the text of Daniel 31-45, copied from Darfius' post:
Thou, O king, sawest, and behold a great image. This great image, whose brightness was excellent, stood before thee; and the form thereof was terrible. This image's head was of fine gold, his breast and his arms of silver, his belly and his thighs of brass, His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay. Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.
This is the dream; and we will tell the interpretation thereof before the king. Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory. And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold. And after thee shall arise another kingdom inferior to thee, and another third kingdom of brass, which shall bear rule over all the earth. And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise. And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay. And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken. And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay. And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever. Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter: and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=20172&page=2
Darfius claims Daniel 2 specifically predicted "the Medo-Persian empire...the Grecian empire...Under the leadership of Alexander the Great...[and] the Roman Empire".
Does this prophecy count as a scientific hypothesis which successfully made scientific predictions?
I'll copy-paste Darfius' arguments here:
Bible passage: Daniel 2:32-33
Written: about 530 BC
Fulfilled: Throughout history; to be completed during End Times
In Daniel 2:32-33, there is a passage that symbolically identified the four great kingdoms that would rise up and control much of world, beginning in Daniel's lifetime. The passage uses symbolic imagery:
1. The head of gold, as Daniel explained, refers to the Babylonian empire that ruled much of the world about 2600 years ago.
2. Daniel said that the head-of-gold empire would be followed by an empire symbolized by arms of silver. Christian scholars have often interpreted this to refer to the Medo-Persian empire which later conquered the Babylonian empire. The scholars say that the two arms refer to the two groups - the Medes and the Persians - who comprised the Medo-Persian empire.
3. The third kingdom was symbolized by the statue's belly and thighs of brass. Some scholars believe that this is a reference to the Grecian empire, which conquered the Medo-Persian empire. The symbol of a belly and thighs of brass suggests that the kingdom was to start out as a united empire but end up as a divided empire. Under the leadership of Alexander the Great, the Grecian Empire was a united empire. But after Alexander's death, the empire was divided into four parts and was later reduced to two parts.
4. The fourth symbol - that of iron legs and feet that were part iron and part clay - has often been suggested to be a reference to the Roman Empire, which later conquered the Grecian Empire. The Roman Empire was very powerful, but it was also very diverse, claiming dominion over a wide variety of different nations. That diversity later contributed to the downfall of the empire.
These four kingdoms ruled over much of the world, and each of the four ruled over the land of Israel during times in which a significant number of Jews - and perhaps a majority of Jews - were living in their homeland. Before the collapse of the Roman Empire, Jerusalem was destroyed and hundreds of thousands of Jews were forced into exile. Even today, a majority of Jews still live outside of Israel. Many Christian scholars suggest that the Roman Empire will be revived and will once again seek to control Israel.
Quick aside, the European Union refers to itself as the Revived Roman Empire.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=20172&page=2
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