Originally posted by Rajk999 Ok .. that was almost like pulling teeth. Now do you have a comment on the reference from John regarding the doctrine of Christ? Or would you rather decline comment on the grounds that it might incriminate you?
Not really, as I said it's an oxymoron. Anyone claiming to be a Christian could be an antichrist. What stick is it you want to beat the rest of us with now?
Originally posted by divegeester Not really, as I said it an oxymoron. Anyone claiming to be a Christian could be an antichrist. What stick is it you want to beat the rest of us with now?
The problem here is that you are deliberately trying to focus on the non-issue of whether or not a 'fake' Christian can be antichrist.
The issue is that John is saying that those who does not bring the doctrine of Christ [ie of brotherly love etc etc], they are antichrist.
Do you have a comment on that?
In a previous post I said that many Christians speak in a derogatory manner of the teachings of Christ... YOU INCLUDED.
Originally posted by Rajk999 In a previous post I said that many Christians speak in a derogatory manner the teachings of Christ... YOU INCLUDED.
What say you?
I'm not going to respond to your flaming my friend. You are entitled to your opinion of me and if that includes me being an "antichrist" then so be it.
Originally posted by divegeester I'm not going to respond to your flaming my friend. You are entitled to your opinion of me and if that includes me being an "antichrist" then so be it.
Flaming ? Whats that? Is that like in the Lake of Fire?
Your desire not to respond is perfectly understandable. Its not what I say. Its John who says that anyone who does not bring the doctrine of Christ are deceivers.
If you have in the past used any of these:
- works righteousness
- law keeping when referring to Christ's commandments
- self-righteousness
- hypocritical
- trying to earn ones salvation
- insulting to Christ death and resurrection.
Originally posted by Rajk999 Flaming ? Whats that? Is that like in the Lake of Fire?
Your desire not to respond is perfectly understandable. Its not what I say. Its John who says that anyone who does not bring the doctrine of Christ are deceivers.
If you have in the past used any of these:
- works righteousness
- law keeping when referring to Christ's commandments
- self-rig ...[text shortened]... to earn ones salvation
- insulting to Christ death and resurrection.
Originally posted by Rajk999 It seems that John is saying that it is indeed likely.
[i]For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist... He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not int ...[text shortened]... lieve it or teach it, then chances are that Christ may consider you a deceiver or an antichrist.
Just so I know, because we have debated this point on more than one time.
You now agree with me that not everyone who claims to be a Christian is?
You used to get on me about that one.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJay Just so I know, because we have debated this point on more than one time.
You now agree with me that not everyone who claims to be a Christian is?
You used to get on me about that one.
Kelly
I never distinguish between true Christians and other Christians as you do. I use the standard English definition of a Christian which is someone who claims that he is such.
So there are 45,000 Christians lets say where I live. I dont make any attempt to identify who are real or true. That is Christ's job.
Originally posted by Rajk999 I never distinguish between true Christians and other Christians as you do. I use the standard English definition of a Christian which is someone who claims that he is such.
So there are 45,000 Christians lets say where I live. I dont make any attempt to identify who are real or true. That is Christ's job.
I never once said you had to identify them, even though you seem to want
to by this thread. If you acknowledge that someone can make the claim,
and yet refuse Christ's leadership, I'm not sure why you'd apply the word
Christian to those that refuse Christ's Lordship, after all they do not belong
to Him.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJay I never once said you had to identify them, even though you seem to want
to by this thread. If you acknowledge that someone can make the claim,
and yet refuse Christ's leadership, I'm not sure why you'd apply the word
Christian to those that refuse Christ's Lordship, after all they do not belong
to Him.
Kelly
Well I dont know who refuse Christ Lordship and who do not. I would only know who claim to be Christian.
Now the reason for this thread is that John appears to be saying that the deceiver or antichrist are not only those who deny that Christ came in the flesh, but also those who DENY THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST.
Originally posted by Rajk999 Well I dont know who refuse Christ Lordship and who do not. I would only know who claim to be Christian.
Now the reason for this thread is that John appears to be saying that the deceiver or antichrist are not only those who deny that Christ came in the flesh, but also those who DENY THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST.
To me the second offence is worse than the first.
John did not lump them with believers as you do when you continue to
apply the name Christian to them.
Kelly
Originally posted by Rajk999 Well its Johns self-certified opinion that you are a deceiver and antichrist. His opinions are from good sources unlike yours.
I would be shaking in my boots if I were you and hoping those everlasting torment believers are wrong.
So there it is, I disagree with you so I'm an antichrist and I'm going to burn forever in the fiery brimstone thing. For what, making a mistake?
Originally posted by Rajk999 I never distinguish between true Christians and other Christians as you do. I use the standard English definition of a Christian which is someone who claims that he is such.
So there are 45,000 Christians lets say where I live. I dont make any attempt to identify who are real or true. That is Christ's job.
Well you had better hope the standard English definition is correct or you could find yourself getting fried with the rest of us.
Originally posted by KellyJay I never once said you had to identify them, even though you seem to want
to by this thread. If you acknowledge that someone can make the claim,
and yet refuse Christ's leadership, I'm not sure why you'd apply the word
Christian to those that refuse Christ's Lordship, after all they do not belong
to Him.
Kelly
I apply the word Christian the way the general public applies the word Christian. I do that to facilitate communication. So people know what Im talking about. I dont make up my definitions.
Of course there are people who Christ will not accept but I dont know.
In this thread John is making a statement about those who bring the doctrine of CHrist and who do not.
I notice that you refuse to comment on that topic.
06 Sep '14 19:161 edit
Can a Christian be AntiChrist?
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