Originally posted by divegeesterNo. John is saying that if someone does not bring the doctrine of Christ then they are a deceiver and antichrist.
So there it is, I disagree with you so I'm an antichrist and I'm going to burn forever in the fiery brimstone thing. For what, making a mistake?
If you are in that category then you should sort that out.
ANTICHRIST
This word means “against (or instead of) Christ.” It occurs a total of five times, singular and plural, all of them in two of John’s epistles.
The subject was not new among the Christians when John wrote his letters (c. 98 C.E.). First John 2:18 states: “Young children, it is the last hour, and, just as you have heard that antichrist [Gr., an·ti′khri·stos] is coming, even now there have come to be many antichrists; from which fact we gain the knowledge that it is the last hour.” John’s statement shows that there are many individual antichrists, though all together they may form a composite person designated “the antichrist.” (2Jo 7) The use of the expression “hour” as referring to a period of time, either relatively brief or of undetermined length, is exemplified in other writings of John. (See Joh 2:4; 4:21-23; 5:25, 28; 7:30; 8:20; 12:23, 27.) He thus did not restrict the appearance, existence, and activity of such antichrist to some future time only but showed that the antichrist was then present and would continue on.—1Jo 4:3.
Identification.
Although there has been much effort in the past to identify “the antichrist” with an individual, such as Pompey, Nero, or Muhammad (this latter person being suggested by Pope Innocent III in 1213 C.E.), or with a specific organization, as in the Protestant view of “the antichrist” as applying to the papacy, John’s inspired statements show the term to be broad in its application, embracing all those who deny that “Jesus is the Christ,” and who deny that Jesus is the Son of God who came “in the flesh.”—1Jo 2:22; 4:2, 3; 2Jo 7, NE, NIV; compare Joh 8:42, 48, 49; 9:22.
Denial of Jesus as the Christ and as the Son of God of necessity embraces the denial of any or all of the Scriptural teachings concerning him: his origin, his place in God’s arrangement, his fulfillment of the prophecies in the Hebrew Scriptures as the promised Messiah, his ministry and teachings and prophecies, as well as any opposition to or efforts to replace him in his position as God’s appointed High Priest and King. This is evident from other texts, which, while not using the term “antichrist,” express essentially the same idea. Thus, Jesus stated: “He that is not on my side is against me, and he that does not gather with me scatters.” (Lu 11:23) Second John 7 shows that such ones might act as deceivers, and hence the “antichrist” would include those who are “false Christs” and “false prophets,” as well as those who perform powerful works in Jesus’ name and yet are classed by him as “workers of lawlessness.”—Mt 24:24; 7:15, 22, 23.
In view of Jesus’ rule that what is done to his true followers is done to him (Mt 25:40, 45; Ac 9:5), the term must include those who persecute such ones, which means it would include the symbolic “Babylon the Great.”—Lu 21:12; Re 17:5, 6.
John specifically mentions apostates as among those of the antichrist by referring to those who “went out from us,” abandoning the Christian congregation. (1Jo 2:18, 19) It therefore includes “the man of lawlessness” or “son of destruction” described by Paul, as well as the “false teachers” Peter denounces for forming destructive sects and who “disown even the owner that bought them.”—2Th 2:3-5; 2Pe 2:1.
Kingdoms, nations, and organizations are similarly shown to be part of the antichrist in the symbolic description at Revelation 17:8-15; 19:19-21.—Compare Ps 2:1, 2.
In all the above cases those composing the antichrist are shown to be headed for eventual destruction as a recompense for their opposing course.
Originally posted by galveston75If one were to Google the content of your post, would one find it to be an unattributed copy paste of someone else's writing, by any chance?
ANTICHRIST
This word means “against (or instead of) Christ.” It occurs a total of five times, singular and plural, all of them in two of John’s epistles.
The subject was not new among the Christians when John wrote his letters (c. 98 C.E.). First John 2:18 states: “Young children, it is the last hour, and, just as you have heard that antichrist [ ...[text shortened]... hrist are shown to be headed for eventual destruction as a recompense for their opposing course.
RajK Typed:
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...They also condemn the following of Christ commandments as 'works salvation', as 'keeping the law'. or as unecessary, and an insult to Christ sacrifice.
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It is good that RajK brought this point up. Just as a start... The Law of God given to the Israelites and the Commandments of Christ are separate things. Secondly, keeping the whole Israelite Law is fine, but will not earn eternal life. Thirdly, keeping the Commandments of Christ is good and proper after a person is saved already, but the keeping of Christ's Commandments will not earn eternal life. Putting faith in Christ as Savior is the action which God honors and which allows God to give a person eternal life.
If a person was to keep perfectly every command of Christ for the rest of the person's life after he or she turned 4 years old, that person will not earn eternal life.
A person must put faith in Christ as his or her Savior. Salvation is in Christ Jesus alone. Through Christ Jesus is how a person is given a relationship with God. Through Christ Jesus is how a person is given eternal life. Through the blood of Christ is how people's sins are covered. If a person never puts faith in Christ Jesus as Savior, then that person is not born again.
Lastly, keeping the Law of God as the Israelites were supposed to keep during a period of time is not against God. Keeping Christ's commandments is not against God either. But neither the keeping of God's Law for the Israelites, nor the keeping of Christ's Commandments will earn eternal life for any person. If you want to please God by keeping Christ's Commandments, then first put faith in Christ for salvation. After you are saved, then keep Christ's Commandments. Keep them to your heart's content, but don't depend on them to earn eternal life for you.
What RajK may misunderstand...
is that a person who puts faith in Christ as Savior is given eternal life. Keeping the commandments of Christ does not earn eternal life. Keeping Christ's Commandments is good and proper after a person is saved, but before a person is saved, the person will never gain eternal life through keeping Christ's Commandments. It is likewise with the whole Law of God to the Israelites. After you have eternal life already through faith in Christ, then please God with keeping Christ's Commandments, but don't ever depend on keeping of Christ's Commandments as how you will have eternal life. You will not. Christ is the way.
What RajK might think...
A person gains eternal life through keeping Christ's Commandments. But that is not true. First, please God by putting faith in Christ as Savior. After you are saved already, After you have eternal life, then keep Christ's Commandments in order to please God. Don't ever keep Christ's Commandments as the way you are saved. Christ is the way.
King James Version
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John 3: 5
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 1: 12, 13
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
John 14: 6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
I Peter 1: 3-5
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
RajK typed:
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...They therefore actively discourage people from following the commandments Christ gave.
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RajK,
I never said to not keep the commandments of Christ. But I do say not to keep the commandments of Christ as your way of salvation. Never depend on keeping the commandments of Christ as how you gain eternal life.
Lastly, if you want it to matter to God that you keep Christ's commandments, then first put faith in Christ as Savior. Then, you can please God because you are a child of God. Don't think that keeping Christ's commandments before you are a child of God will earn you eternal life.
King James Version
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I John 5: 11, 12
And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
John 3: 36
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Originally posted by KingOnPointWhat exactly of the doctrine of Christ do you 'bring'? Anything? To bring a doctrine means that you teach it, preach it, believe it, tell others about it etc etc. Can you quote a reference of something Christ said that you 'bring'? If so please quote.
... not to keep the commandments of Christ as your way of salvation. ...
I will help you out. The central focus of the doctrine of Christ is love, ie brotherly love, charitable love and a range of commandments which demonstrate love for your neighbour.
Since you have been here on this forum how often have you posted positive comments on the doctrine of Christ of brotherly and charitable love ?
If my memory serves me I can only remember negative comments from you on the doctrine of Christ. I have seen you decry it as:
- works righteousness
- trying to earn your salvation
- hypocrisy and self-righteousness
- pointless and useless law keeping
- and other comments designed to discourage followers of Christ.
People like you actively discourage people or turn people away from Christ. Christ spoke of those like you when he said:
Mark 9:42 And whosoever shall offend [to cause to stumble, to trip up] one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
How do you respond to what Christ said about you, and what John said about you in II John Chapter 1.
People like you that preach your antiChrist doctrine have a lot answer for. Think about that before replying like a robot.
RajK Typed:
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People like you that preach your antiChrist doctrine have a lot answer for. Think about that before replying like a robot.
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I care about your destiny, RajK. I want people to come to Christ for salvation. Do you believe that a person can skip putting faith in Christ and just keep commandments and gain eternal life? Your salvation is in the Son of God. Please don't miss out on being saved by Christ Jesus Himself. No commandments died for you. Christ died for you.
Do you believe that Christ is not needed to be saved. Look back to see how many times I have put emphasis on Christ Himself. I hope someday you will realize how absolutely necessary Christ is.
If all you focus on are commandments, but miss putting faith in Christ as your Savior, then your keeping of commandments will not help you.
Focus on Christ. Haven't you been focusing on commandments for eternal life rather than Christ, Himself? Salvation is in Christ. Salvation is not in commandments.
Faith in Jesus as Savior is part of the Gospel. No matter how many of Christ's commandments you keep, you will not be saved by commandments. Christ is able to save Israelites and Gentiles. You are included.
Christ is the center. Christ is the Savior. Put faith in Christ as your Savior and you are given eternal life. If you want to live as Christ, then do so after you first put faith in Him for your salvation.
RajK, focus on what Christ did for you. He came to earth, lived a sinless life, shed His blood for your sins, died and rose again so that you can have forgiveness of your sins and eternal life.
King James Version
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Romans 8: 31, 32, 38, 39
What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Galatians 2: 20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
RajK,
King James Version
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John 3: 14-16
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Originally posted by Rajk999Wow.
What exactly of the doctrine of Christ do you 'bring'? Anything? To bring a doctrine means that you teach it, preach it, believe it, tell others about it etc etc. Can you quote a reference of something Christ said that you 'bring'? If so please quote.
I will help you out. The central focus of the doctrine of Christ is love, ie brotherly love, charitable ...[text shortened]... h your antiChrist doctrine have a lot answer for. Think about that before replying like a robot.
I don't see any brotherly love in this post, either, in fact in any of your posts. All I see is anger. Anger that he dares to disagree with you. Something you've shunned several in this forum for already.