Catholicism is heretical

Originally posted by @rajk999
I dont think either of you understand and appreciate what 'grace' means in the bible

Enlighten us.

Originally posted by @vivify
Your argument is since that one particular passage was addressed to Ephesians, that it applies to no one else. That's fallacious, rendering your argument invalid. You're a prime example of the fallacies Catholicism produces.

Not fallacious. Do you pay your neighbor’s bills that come in the mail addressed to him?

Originally posted by @vivify
Enlighten us.

Here is one sentence that tells the whole story of grace:

For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, (Titus 2:11 KJV)

Do you understand it?

The thing about Ephesus was that it was the site of one of the Seven Wonders of the Ancient world - the Temple to Artemis. This is probably why there are comments about what women are allowed to do - because Paul didn’t want the Church in Ephesus to become tainted by heretical ideas of pagan Artemis.

Vivify, do you apply the following to your wife?

Ephesians 5:22 Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

Originally posted by @athousandyoung
Vivify, do you apply the following to your wife?

Ephesians 5:22 Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. 24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

No. I'm not religious. That only applies to Christians.

Originally posted by @athousandyoung
Not fallacious. Do you pay your neighbor’s bills that come in the mail addressed to him?

Does not committing adultery only apply to Jews who received the Ten Commandments? How about not committing murder? Worshiping other gods? They weren't addressed to you, so screw that, right?

See how dumb your logic is?

Originally posted by @rajk999
Here is one sentence that tells the whole story of grace:

For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, (Titus 2:11 KJV)

Do you understand it?

I can see that by your lack of response you dont care what Paul said about grace. I think that Pauls teachings is not what you think it is.

Grace is unmerited favour from God. Unmerited means that you did nothing to deserve it and its is a free gift of God. Its is not because of your good works that you got this grace from God.

Specifically it refers to God sending his Son to die for mankinds sins. This death and resurrection of Christ brought an opportunity for eternal life for all men. Prior to Christ's death there was no such opportunity as man would die in their sins without the sacrifice of Christ.

What comes out of this is:
- The grace of Christ's death is for ALL MEN. Not just Christians
- This grace does not automatically give the Christian professing faith, eternal life.
- This grace is God and Jesus doing their part.
- Grace does not ensure that man does his part which is to live according to the commandments of Christ.
- Only those who live righteously [Christ will judge all people]., will inherit the Kingdom of God.

I dont think you understood grace to mean all of that.

Originally posted by @rajk999
Grace is unmerited favour from God. Unmerited means that you did nothing to deserve it and its is a free gift of God. Its is not because of your good works that you got this grace from God.

I dont think you understood grace to mean all of that.

First page of this thread:

Originally posted by @vivify
GRACE
ɡrās
noun

(in Christian belief) the free and unmerited favor of God, as manifested in the salvation of sinners and the bestowal of blessings.

The bible claims God's "grace" has nothing to do with how good or righteous a person is, and that is God's grace that saves people full of sin.

You basically repeated what I said. I used the same point you just made to show why Mary being "full of grace" in no way shows she's "not a sinner", since the Bible says grace was shown to ALL men.

Originally posted by @vivify
Does not committing adultery only apply to Jews who received the Ten Commandments? How about not committing murder? Worshiping other gods? They weren't addressed to you, so screw that, right?

See how dumb your logic is?

I’m not Christian either. I’m just pointing out what the Bible says. Maybe we should end this thread with a chuckle about the silliness of ALL Christians. Not just Catholics.

Originally posted by @athousandyoung
I’m not Christian either. I’m just pointing out what the Bible says. Maybe we should end this thread with a chuckle about the silliness of ALL Christians. Not just Catholics.

You attacked me on the debate forum for saying Catholics don't follow the bible. The point is, you're wrong in thinking otherwise. Catholics pretty much worship her and have turned her into a near-deity, contradicting Bible scriptures like (all have sinned) in order to do so.

The Catholic Church even states that their own Catechism outranks the bible.

But I'll agree this whole thing is silly, and end with that as well.

Originally posted by @athousandyoung
Catholicism is not "schismatic". Even the Orthodox recognize the primacy of the Bishop of Rome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravenna_Document

That aspect is actually irrelevant.

From an Orthodox perspective the cause of the schism was that the Catholics embellished beyond what the scriptures said and no longer accurately represented the Gospel.

Of course I understand if Catholics put this on us.

But are you a Catholic? Or what side are you on with this? I am curious.

Of course I have no problem if someone thinks Catholicism is the true church or has some issue with orthodoxy. But I think that we are not having a good interaction because you should maybe think of it like...

Of course someone who is an Orthodox believer would not think of themselves as the schismatics.

And of course the Orthodox recognized the Pope as the first among equals at one point.

But that stopped and now belongs to the Ecumenical Patriarch in Constantinople.

Originally posted by @philokalia
That aspect is actually irrelevant.

From an Orthodox perspective the cause of the schism was that the Catholics embellished beyond what the scriptures said and no longer accurately represented the Gospel.

Of course I understand if Catholics put this on us.

But are you a Catholic? Or what side are you on with this? I am curious.

I'm an atheist from a Catholic ancestry.