Spirituality

Spirituality

  1. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 14:362 edits
    Paul ever faithful to Jesus Christ, taught that the very place where God can justify man is Christ. He is not only the propitiation or the One who propitiates. He is the propitiation place.

    Being justifies freely by His grace through the redemption in Christ Jesus:

    Whom God set forth a propitiation-cover through faith in blood, for the showing forth of His righteousness ..." (Romans 3:24,25a)


    The word here in Greek is hilasterion. [transliterated]. The KJV called this place "the mercy seat". It was the lid on the ark of the covenant - the place where in the holy of holies in the temple God said he would meet with the high priest.

    Christ is a place where redeemed sinful man is qualified to meet with the God of glory who is absolutely perfect in righteousness and absolutely holy in being distinct from all other things in existence.
  2. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 15:011 edit
    The word hilasterion is the noun form of a word used both as a verb meaning "to appease, to reconcile one by satisfying the other's demand.

    That is hilaskomai. Christ is the place - hilasterion where the reconciling two estranged parties takes place. Man fell into sin and was joined to God's enemy, the Devil. The demand upon humans of God's glory, God's righteousness, and God's holiness made a chasm of enmity between the two parties.

    Man had joined the opposition party against the Creator. And this made human beings estranged and alienated from contacting God and receiving the life of God.

    The symbolism of the ark of the covenant and all the furniture in the tabernacle (and then the temple) spoke of the salvation to cause the two parties to be brought back together in reconciliation.

    The writer of Hebrews speaks a bit about the ark of the covenant in the central section of the tabernacle God instructed Moses to erect according to strict details.

    See," He said, "that you make all things according to the pattern that was sown to you in the mountain." (Heb. 8:5 comp. Exodus 25:40)


    Central to the tabernacle was a piece of furniture called an ark. Two cherubim of gold faced each other on the top of it. They were like angelic creatures representing the glory of God.


    Between them a lid on which atoning blood from various offerings was to be sprinkled. Inside the compartment of the ark was the the tablets of the ten commandments, the rod of Aaron the budded miraculously, and a sample of the mann or bread from heaven by which the Israelites were sustained forty years in the wilderness.

    This lid was the place where God's voice would speak from between the cheribum of glory over top of the blood sprinkled hilasterion or "propitiation-cover".

    Now Paul teaches that the Person of Jesus Christ is the reality to which this peculiar Old Testament symbolically pointed. The "place" in the universe where God can meet with man is the man Jesus.

    [Christ] Whom God set forth a propitiation-cover through faith in His blood ... " (Rem. 3:25)
  3. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    03 Feb '19 15:211 edit
    @sonship

    Will you be citing your source with your next post?
  4. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 15:28
    The usage of hiloskomai we can see here:

    1.) "And He Himself is the propitiation [HILASKOMAI] for our sins, and not for ours only but also for those of the whole world." (1 John 2:2)

    2.) "Herein is love, not that we have loved God but that He loved us and sent His Son as a propitiation [HILASKOMAI] for our sins." (1 John 4:10)

    The demands of one party upon the other is met such that an appeasement is secured. The legal demand of the law of God made terrible demand of payment for sins, transgressions, offenses, crimes, wrong doings. All of which set man at enmity with God.

    Man becomes an enemy of God. Though God loves man, man has become an enemy with debts owed to his Maker as a result of his being joined to the Devil and fallen into sinning.

    Christ, Paul says, has been set forth by God as the place, the hilasterion where propitiation takes place and the awful demand of God upon us is filled.

    This physical place was described in Exodus 25:16-22 and in Leviticus 16:12-16.

    KIng James Bible translated this place as the mercy seat. A better translations is "propitiation - place".

    Within the ark were the Ten Commandments exposing and condemning all offenders. The lid covered them. The two cherubim of angelic glory were situated at each end of the lid. Their wings towards one another in a guarding like posture - guarding the glory of God.

    The high priest was to take the atoning blood of the sacrifices and sprinkle the lid. There God would meet him. If things were not done according to specifications the high priest could die.

    More than one sloppy priest was consumed with fire improperly disregarding the holiness of serving God in the tabernacle. God said that He would be regarded as holy.

    The picture underscoring that to approach God required the real guilt of the real sins of man be removed as an obstacle.

    The Creator of the universe and its King informs mankind "I shall be regarded as holy."

    Jesus Christ is that "place" where joyful oneness between man and God may be recovered. The demands of God propitiated for by His Son on our behalf.
  5. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 15:33
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke

    You can read more in a number of places.
    A good place to start would be the footnotes of the Recovery Version Bible concerning the verses I am expounding.

    Try the online Recovery Version.

    https://online.recoveryversion.bible/?_ga=2.259900674.922769958.1549207852-492809990.1535698727

    Do you ever learn something so well that it kind of is accumulated in your memory and you can be conversant about it rather easily ?
  6. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    03 Feb '19 16:25
    @sonship said

    Do you ever learn something so well that it kind of is accumulated in your memory and you can be conversant about it rather easily?
    Yes, but I don't believe that is what you have done here.
  7. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 20:18
    On what thread were we talking about reincarnation ?
  8. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 20:411 edit
    Hebrews 9

    Now then the first covenant also had ordinances of service, and its sanctuary of this world. (v.1)


    The furniture and the ordinances of service were all very symbolic of God's way of eternal salvation.

    For a taberncacle was prepared, the first. om wjocj were the lampstand and the table and the loves that were set forth, which is called the Holy Place. (v.2)


    Both tabernacle erected in the wilderness and the more solid temple in Jerusalem built by Solomon had three major sections - the Outer Court, the Holy Place, and the Holy of Holies.

    The Holy of Holies was the innermost chamber of the structure. There only once a year on the Day of Atonement the high priest entered to propitiation of the sins of the Israelites and to meet with God at the PLACE - the before the lid over the ark of the covenant the propitiatory cover.

    And after the second veil, a tabernacle, which is called the Holy of Holies. (v.3)


    The three parts of the temple also speak of the three parts of man's being - the body, the soul, and the human spirit. The human spirit is the nucleus and kernel of our spiritual being. It is the innermost place. It is a place reserved for us and God to be united as one.

    This is a lot to take in. But the Holy of Holies is both the innermost chamber of the temple of God and stands for the innermost chamber of man's creation.

    In our human spirit Christ can come and be the very place where God and man can meet in the deepest part of our spiritual being. So the "place" to meet God is both Christ Himself once He comes into us and our innermost Holy of Holies - our human spirit.

    The Holy of Holies with the ark of the covenant was visited once a year on the Day of Atonement, and not without the blood of the sacrifice to sprinkle on the so called "mercy seat" or properly "the propitiation - cover". In spite of the condemning law of God exposing and convicting below in the ark, the blood on the lid allowed the high priest to contact the living God of glory in peace and in security.

    " ... the Holy of Holies, having the Ark of the Covenant covered about everywhere with gold, in which were the golden pot that had the manna and Aaron's rod that budded and the tablets of the covenant. (v.3b,4)

    And above it cherubim of glory overshadowing the expiation cover, concerning which it is not now the time to speak in detail." (v.5)


    The writer of the letter to the Hebrews wanted to say more things. But he did not just then. He most likely wanted to elaborate on the the significance of items of furniture in the Holy of Holies as to what deep realities they taught in God's full salvation.
  9. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    03 Feb '19 21:09
    @sonship said
    On what thread were we talking about reincarnation ?
    You didn't do very well in that discussion sir. I recommend not returning to it.
  10. Stargazing
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    03 Feb '19 22:32
    @ghost-of-a-duke said
    @sonship

    Will you be citing your source with your next post?
    🙂
  11. Standard membersonship
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    03 Feb '19 23:103 edits
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke
    You didn't do very well in that discussion sir. I recommend not returning to it.


    Like I sit around waiting for your recommendations ?
  12. Stargazing
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    04 Feb '19 09:29
    @sonship said
    @Ghost-of-a-Duke
    You didn't do very well in that discussion sir. I recommend not returning to it.


    Like I sit around waiting for your recommendations ?
    I recommend that you cite your sources sonship and stop presenting the ideas of other people as being your own.
  13. Standard memberSecondSon
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    04 Feb '19 10:22
    @divegeester said
    I recommend that you cite your sources sonship and stop presenting the ideas of other people as being your own.
    I recommend you give an example of where sonship presented an idea that was not his own.

    And while you're at it try to get an idea of your own instead of mimicking others.
  14. SubscriberFMF
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    04 Feb '19 10:30
    @secondson said
    I recommend you give an example of where sonship presented an idea that was not his own.
    Has he not posted tens of thousands of posts in which he simply regurgitated the writings of Watchman Nee and Witness Lee and other stuff from his cultish "The Local Churches" outfit? They would constitute and contain maybe hundreds of thousands of examples of ideas that were not his own, but that had rote-learned, internalized, and then recited here on this message board thread after thread, week after week, year in year out, for as long a I have been a member of this community.
  15. Standard memberSecondSon
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    04 Feb '19 11:05
    @fmf said
    Has he not posted tens of thousands of posts in which he simply regurgitated the writings of Watchman Nee and Witness Lee and other stuff from his cultish "The Local Churches" outfit? They would constitute and contain maybe hundreds of thousands of examples of ideas that were not his own, but that had rote-learned, internalized, and then recited here on this message board thread ...[text shortened]... ter thread, week after week, year in year out, for as long a I have been a member of this community.
    Sonship has quoted his sources tens of thousands of times.

    That he believes what his sources say and "regurgitated" those beliefs again in his own words is no crime.

    I've read your own regurgitated posts. You say the same things constantly.

    Most of the stuff you and your shadow say in response to your pet detractors is regurgitated in these forums thread after thread, and simply for the single purpose of belittling anyone that believes in anything you don't.

    You're quick to point out the flaws of others while ignoring your own. Your use of language in these threads is both inflammatory and insulting of the character of posters that hold views contrary to your own because you refuse to address the content of the topics being discussed.

    Whatever. You're free to say anything you want.
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