Originally posted by C U Soon…if that was to happen, then the human race would become extinct -> making the creation of earth kind of useless....…
if that was to happen, then the human race would become extinct -> making the creation of earth kind of useless. God is allowing babies to die just as much as he allows someone from any other age group to die.
he wants us to stand in relationship with him (reason why we were created)
Agreed.
…God is allowing babies to die just as much as he allows someone from any other age group to die.
he wants us to stand in relationship with him (reason why we were created)
...…
I assume what you mean here by “stand in relationship with him” is go to heaven?
-if so than that makes sense to me if that is really what you believe.
By the way, what does this”“” and “”” mean that you put in place of the quotation marks?
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Originally posted by mazda9934As a Christian, I do not like it anymore than you do. Our first child was a miscarraige.
Please bring to mind your image of God.
Then, please tell me why he allows very small children to suffer and die ??
(No one has EVER given me a plausible answer to this question)
Though it is difficult to explain why it must be, at least we see that God is moving history in the direction where it one day will never be.
The way things ARE has many tragadies. At least we see the way things are headed will be free from such tragedies.
Such a promise motivates me to cooperate with God's full salvation.
Originally posted by Andrew HamiltonI assume what you mean here by “stand in relationship with him” is go to heaven?
[b]…if that was to happen, then the human race would become extinct -> making the creation of earth kind of useless....…
Agreed.
…God is allowing babies to die just as much as he allows someone from any other age group to die.
he wants us to stand in relationship with him (reason why we were created)
...… ...[text shortened]... 8221;“” and “”” mean that you put in place of the quotation marks?[/b]
wrongly assumed. to be in relationship with God is to study His word and live your life completely devoted to him, and eventually (after death that is) go to heaven.
i have absolutely no idea how ”“” got in that quote, sorry.
Originally posted by josephwSo a hurricane or a major earthquake comes along and kills people by the thousands including children, that is mankind's fault?
Have you ever considered the possibility that the question is misleading?
Could it be possible that it is man that is allowing innocent children to die?
If one is an atheist, then blaming God for the death of innocent children is a mute point.
If one is a theist, then the blame for the death of innocent children falls squarely on man.
Feeding a ...[text shortened]... d be better spent on caring for the children.
Our priorities are screwed up if you ask me.
Originally posted by Andrew HamiltonNo. I simply WAS open to these feelings -there was no “choosing“ about it. ----hamilton-------------
[b]…You may not have chosen to fall in love...…
Correct.
…but within you probably had the ability to squash or deny these feelings (as people often do). ...…
Firstly, I am not aware of any ability to squash or deny my feelings -perhaps you have this ability but that would just mean that we have very different psychology.
Sec ...[text shortened]... omebody that I just don’t naturally love no matter how much I think I “should” love that person.[/b]
I define them as choices , therefore they are . That'd work eh?
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Originally posted by C U SoonSounds like it's morally right to go out and kill as many babies as possible. If you let them grow up, they might reject God and miss their chance at heaven. Don't let people deter you by calling you names like 'inconsiderate', or 'sick, heinous baby-murderer', etc. - just know that you're giving them all a better life.
God is a spirit. When the baby die, he/she dies physically. That is a problem for most non-believers and some believers as well. The baby will go to heaven and be spared from this evil, filthy earth. So you might think he is inconsiderate or whatever, but which is best? Living on earth or in heaven?
Originally posted by SwissGambityou could do that...if you'd like to burn in hell for eternity. Jesus already died for their sins, you don't have to try and do it.
Sounds like it's morally right to go out and kill as many babies as possible. If you let them grow up, they might reject God and miss their chance at heaven. Don't let people deter you by calling you names like 'inconsiderate', or 'sick, heinous baby-murderer', etc. - just know that you're giving them all a better life.
it's their parents' job to teach them and show them the truth. just because your parents didn't do a good job doesn't mean you should go 'save' the rest of the world.
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Originally posted by C U SoonThat's a risk I'm willing to take. Jesus only gives people a chance to go to heaven. By killing them when they're infants, I guarantee that they go to heaven. My plan of salvation is far more efficient.
you could do that...if you'd like to burn in hell for eternity. Jesus already died for their sins, you don't have to try and do it.
it's their parents' job to teach them and show them the truth. just because your parents didn't do a good job doesn't mean you should go 'save' the rest of the world.
Originally posted by SwissGambityes, but little john or amy that you plan to kill do have someting else planned for them. maybe convert a friend in high school or even something smaller, God only knows.
That's a risk I'm willing to take. Jesus only gives people a chance to go to heaven. By killing them when they're infants, I guarantee that they go to heaven. My plan of salvation is far more efficient.
Originally posted by C U SoonWhat better plan could there be for little john or amy than immediate eternal life in heaven? I'm doing them a favor by offing them.
yes, but little john or amy that you plan to kill do have someting else planned for them. maybe convert a friend in high school or even something smaller, God only knows.
They will thank me once they arrive. They'll know I spared them from the 'evil, filthy earth'.
Originally posted by SwissGambiti just said that. they could be used to convert/save other people. that is a lot more important. go to heaven and take a friend with 🙂
What better plan could there be for little john or amy than immediate eternal life in heaven? I'm doing them a favor by offing them.
They will thank me once they arrive. They'll know I spared them from the 'evil, filthy earth'.
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Originally posted by C U SoonConversion saves some of the people you try to convert. Killing them as infants saves them all. Your conversion idea is ineffective, especially when the stakes are so high - people's souls are at risk.
i just said that. they could be used to convert/save other people. that is a lot more important. go to heaven and take a friend with 🙂
Originally posted by sonhouseYou see? You find it much easier to blame God in a bitter way. However if I were to teach you that your decision to turn your life over to Jesus Christ would expedite His physical return and establishing of a peaceful kingdom, you might not want to cooperate.
So a hurricane or a major earthquake comes along and kills people by the thousands including children, that is mankind's fault?
There are the blamers and the cooperators. I am throwing my lot in with the cooperators.
(No, this post does not explain everything about it and leave no unanswered questions )
Originally posted by mazda9934I haven't read all pages of this thread, so I don't know if your q has been answered. Also, I don't know if this is a serious question, or just another Christian-baiter. Nevertheless, let me give you the benefit of the doubt and have a bash:
Please bring to mind your image of God.
Then, please tell me why he allows very small children to suffer and die ??
(No one has EVER given me a plausible answer to this question)
Firstly, your opening statement gives you away. "Bring to mind your image of God". That is 95% of the problem! (I'm not sure what the other 5% are...)
The first Commandment says specifically you must NOT make for yourself an image of God. That includes not only physical, but mental images. It is exactly BECAUSE we make images of God, that the problem arises about, e.g. small children (as well as uncountable other seemingly unjust and/or unmerciful happenings)
The image presented here is the age-old image of God which is a contradiction in terms: God cannot be BOTH good and powerful.
Either He is good, but not powerful enough (to save the child), OR
He is powerful, but not good and/or merciful enough (to save the child).
In other words, God CAN, but WON"T, or God WANTS TO but CAN'T.
Either way, God isn't worth taking seriously.
Clearly, both of these are based on a totally false image of God - one made in OUR image!
God is God, and cannot be comprehend or put in a box or treated like Father Christmas (another common image)
However, this inscrutable God chose to reveal Himself in parts, and these parts include the following:
1 He is all loving
2 He is a Father
3 However, he also gave us Free Will to do with as we please
4 He also created an Independent Nature, governed by special laws that we are still trying to discover.
This has the following consequences:
1 We can and must always trust that he is loving, and not vindictive However, whether we do so or not is our choice.
2 We can run to Him as Father, when we are hurting
3 Things WILL happen in Nature that we don't like, but principles 1 and 2 above aply in all cases.
Another thing about this cosmos that we have been made privy to through the Bible is that we are living in a warzone (this Forum is ample evidence of this, if any were needed!) The current King of this World is not God, but Satan, the fallen angel. Christians are, as it were, guerilla troops under cover! Anybody who knows anything about guerilla warfare knows that there are casualties; pain and hardship is the rule rather than the exception.
To come back to the original question: babies can suffer and die for any one of many reasons:, e.g. a germ, an incurable disease, and even rape and murder. (The latter are endemic in South Africa - there is a local belief that having intercourse with a virgin, even as young as 2 - 4 years old, will cure AIDS!!)
In each case there has been a cause, either natural (disease) or some human made a terrible wrong choice. All of these are within the rules laid down for this planet.
Now God can, and does, intervene in tragic cases, either to prevent miraculously in response to prayer, or to comfort after the event. Many examples could be cited. However, it is as true that sometimes he choses NOT to.
This brings me, in closing, back to my 3 consequences mentioned above, and my final statement:
It does NOT really matter what happens to you on this erath, but what is important is HOW WE REACT to what happens to us.
In peace
CJ
(PS: Sorry for taking so long, and also sorry for not doing a proper spell/grammar check.)
Originally posted by CalJustYou see Cal?
I haven't read all pages of this thread, so I don't know if your q has been answered. Also, I don't know if this is a serious question, or just another Christian-baiter. Nevertheless, let me give you the benefit of the doubt and have a bash:
Firstly, your opening statement gives you away. "Bring to mind your image of God". That is 95% of the problem! (I'm ...[text shortened]... Sorry for taking so long, and also sorry for not doing a proper spell/grammar check.)
When you want to make yourself CLEAR - you sometimes have to write alot.