Originally posted by Lord Shark
Originally posted by josephw
[b]To me, the idea that all the horrifying things done to people, by people, should go unpunished, is untenable.
Isn't that dangerously close to committing the fallacy of argument from adverse consequences?[/b]

So is posting in this forum. 🙄😉

Originally posted by knightmeister
Persoanlly I don't see how heaven could really be a static place as agerg describes , God would just not be God. I fail to see how heaven could boring , it would have to be glorious , stimulating , joyous and fresh. Anything else doesn't make sense.

You mean it doesn't fit into your personal philosophy and certainly would not be what you want it to be - which is what your whole belief system is about - nothing to do with reality.
Although our life on earth can be glorious , stimulating , joyous and fresh, it isn't always yet God quite readily placed us here. I see no reason why he would not continue to place us in similar environments. The whole Christian theology is an attempt to explain why we are in our current predicament and try to suggest a better predicament in future, but on the whole it fails to explain it and relies entirely on 'faith' (read wishful thinking) regarding the future.

Originally posted by twhitehead
You mean it doesn't fit into your personal philosophy and certainly would not be what you want it to be - which is what your whole belief system is about - nothing to do with reality.
Although our life on earth can be glorious , stimulating , joyous and fresh, it isn't always yet God quite readily placed us here. I see no reason why he would not continue ...[text shortened]... s to explain it and relies entirely on 'faith' (read wishful thinking) regarding the future.

You mean it doesn't fit into your personal philosophy and certainly would not be what you want it to be - which is what your whole belief system is about - nothing to do with reality.
----------whitey-------------------------------------------

Don't you mean nothing to do with YOUR reality. Just own your own perceptions here for a minute. Jesus portrayed God as testable and knowable (even intimately so) and many millions of people would testify to this. This is the experiential reality of the world we live in. True or false - the Christian faith IS already part of reality.

As for my vision of heaven - I admit it is very desirable in one sense - but I also find it highly disturbing and threatening in other ways. Joy is both exhilerating but also challenging. If I am honest the heaven I would really like would be a bit more sedate and tedious at times. Too much love and joy could also be unbearable.

Many Christians would agree with me when I say that the way we know we are getting closer to God is when we want to run away. Heaven is a place I would both love to go to but would also at the same time I would rather stay here where it's safe.

Originally posted by knightmeister
This is the experiential reality of the world we live in. True or false - the Christian faith IS already part of reality.

You are deliberately misinterpreting what I mean by 'reality'. But you got what I meant so no need to worry.

As for my vision of heaven - I admit it is very desirable in one sense - but I also find it highly disturbing and threatening in other ways. Joy is both exhilerating but also challenging. If I am honest the heaven I would really like would be a bit more sedate and tedious at times. Too much love and joy could also be unbearable.

Many Christians would agree with me when I say that the way we know we are getting closer to God is when we want to run away. Heaven is a place I would both love to go to but would also at the same time I would rather stay here where it's safe.
Sounds like a bit of a contradiction. Either something is joyful or it is not. It cannot really be joyful and unbearable - though I do get what you mean.
Your fear of heaven is due to your belief that you are a worthless incapable being who needs God for everything.

So how much of your views on heaven are based on actual information from the Bible or other sources and how much did you simply make up to fit what you desire?

Originally posted by twhitehead
You are deliberately misinterpreting what I mean by 'reality'. But you got what I meant so no need to worry.

[b]As for my vision of heaven - I admit it is very desirable in one sense - but I also find it highly disturbing and threatening in other ways. Joy is both exhilerating but also challenging. If I am honest the heaven I would really like would be ...[text shortened]... n from the Bible or other sources and how much did you simply make up to fit what you desire?

Your fear of heaven is due to your belief that you are a worthless incapable being who needs God for everything.
-----------------------------------WHITEY---------------------------

You know this how exactly? Is it some form of cyber-telepathy? I actually think I must be worth quite lot - why would Jesus bother dying for someone who was worthless?

The vision of heaven is drawn from partly my own peak experiences (and others) , partly from the Bible and partly from the writings of other Christians (eg CS LEWIS) and partly from my own logic (eg it would illogical / inconsistent to think that heaven would be joyless) and partly from intuitive guesswork.

Originally posted by josephw
So is posting in this forum. 🙄😉

How so?