for creationists only

Originally posted by aardvarkhome
Yes indeed, what Moses wrote was not science. Why do the supporters of creationism andd ID insist that evolution can take place within kinds when the term is so vague as to have no meaning

I speak for me, let those others speak for themselves.
Kelly

Escuse me... please... for my ignorance... for I am but a simple student of life and chess... or maybe just chess... lol.
Here's a quandary I see in the evolution theory.
Ma and Pa fish mated with ummm... well.. something we will call Ma and Pa leggy and they produced offsprings that is half-fish and half-leggy... something we shall call leggyfish.
Now... Ma and Pa fish must mate with ummm... Ma and Pa Leggy many many times to create many male and female leggyfish which grow up to be Ma and Pa Leggyfish.
Now, Ma and Pa Leggyfish must mate with um... something we will call Ma and Pa Birdie. They ummm.. party a lot and produce many many male and female leggyfishbirdies.
Now... All these Ma and Pa Leggy's and Fish and Birdies.. and their half-breed offsprings must have left tons of bones both male and female. Where are they?
Here's another... Where did Pa Fish find Ma Fish? She is of the same exact species as him but with completely different plumbing...
Isn't evolution a slow process? How long did Pa Fish wait for Ma Fish to evolve?
I know he probably waited much longer than my opponents waited for me to make a move in a game! 🙂

Note - I had to post this in two different posts because Robomod didn't like them in the same post. Apparently they were inappropriate all together for some reason...

OK, so you started with "Ma and Pa fish". Let's look at how the equivalent in evolutionary theory.

In evolutionary theory, there was some species of fish (let's call it the MaPa) with a large population and significant genetic diversity. This population of MaPa was as large as it could possibly get based on the food supply available to it.

Now, on the beaches and banks of the waterways lived some worms and bugs that the MaPa could have eaten if only they could have gotten to them. MaPa which happened to have greater tolerance for being out of water and/or fins which varied in such a way as to help the fish drag itself in mud and wet sand would have been able to access this additional food resource, and the population of MaPa would have been able to increase. The additional MaPa would have had these traits, and the traits would not be likely to be found deep out to sea, because maybe these traits weakened the ability of MaPa to be efficient swimmers and water breathers or something; or maybe the air tolerant fish would have a hard time excreting wastes as easily, or something.

Habits vary too, and MaPa which were good at getting beach worms might tend to succeed even better when they tended to hang out by the shore. Also, MaPa with even better crawling fins and air tolerance would tend to be selected for in this region.

At some point, a population of MaPa which hung out by the shore and happened to be enriched in these particular variations might get separated from the ocean going variety due to geologic change; a landlocked saltwater lake might be formed. Interbreeding between these MaPa and the rest would have halted entirely.

Separate evolution of oceangoing MaPa and the landlocked ones might end up with the landlocked ones developing exceptional crawling ability and air tolerance and the evolution of amphibians simply through natural introduction of variance and natural selection. These amphibians, which we shall call the Leggies, in no case would ever mate with the original MaPa fish. After time they would no longer be genetically compatible and would not even recognize one another's mating signals.

So, as you can see, leggyfish would not have occurred. Your understanding of evolutionary theory is extremely flawed. I hope you're not one of those who is or who pretends to be ignorant on purpose in order to create a strawman in debate.

Now, as far as gender goes, first there were asexual organisms, and then there were organisms that could exchange genes in a sexual manner without being male or female (hermaphrodites?) and only then did the separation of sexes gradually occur. "Pa fish" did not exist independently of "Ma fish".